afib and low carb or keto connection?

So I figure for a lot of people, weight is something that we want to lose or control to some extent. I have been seeing articles lately casting a poor reflection on low carb and/or keto way of eating stating that they cause an increase in afib potential, I think around 16% increase? Trouble is being overweight is also an issue for afib. With that, I am wanting to ask of those here that are low carb or keto if you feel that this has been or may be an issue for you? or on the flip side if either way of eating (low carb / keto) has been a blessing for you and help your afib? thank you, I look forward to learning your experience as it helps me to make decisions for myself.

I think whatever you eat should be in moderation. I once saw a dietitian who had me on 50mg carbs a day. I was overweight but in nsr for years. It put me in afib and the er dr said I should increase my carbs because it shocked me into afib. I don’t exceed 150. Onions carrots and other foods contain carbs.,I use an app diary which is very useful in keeping track of all my daily requirements.

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LaDonna
I have been seeing articles lately casting a poor reflection on low carb and/or keto way of eating stating that they cause an increase in afib potential, I think around 16% increase?

In my experience (I've had afib since 2004 and keto adapted in 2009 and maintained it subsequently), the issue is during keto adaptation and is related to electrolyte disruption. My wife adapted 6 or 8 years ago "gently" and had no "keto flu" symptoms. She's not an afibber and subsequently has water fasted for 7 days without issue. I had one afib episode that I attribute to keto. This was during adaptation and I didn't know any other way to adapt but an Atkins 20 g carb/day - just slam in full stop. I did experience keto flu and had an episode maybe 5 or 10 days in.

I was supplementing with potassium & magnesium, but no sodium chloride. My understanding now is that lowering insulin materially, which keto will do signals the kidneys to excrete sodium (high insulin signals to retain sodium). Sometimes the sodium excretion can be so great that a lot of potassium is excreted with it.

I don't have any certain method of avoiding an episode during adaptation, but here are some thoughts.

Follow Diet Doctor's suggestions for avoiding keto flu: [www.dietdoctor.com]

In addition, perhaps start by slowly compressing your daily eating window to around 6 hours and having that be comfortable. Then start slowly reducing carb intake.

As I mentioned above, once I was adapted, which is now 13 years, I've had no afib issues related to ketosis.

The problem is not whether you are on a carbohydrate or carbohydrate-free diet. The problem is following the right order of foods. I am referring to the excellent book entitled "The glucose revolution", where all the problems relating to glucose spikes are well explained and how to solve them simply by changing the way carbohydrates are eaten, without therefore eliminating them. I recommend reading it to everyone.

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LaDonna
So I figure for a lot of people, weight is something that we want to lose or control to some extent. I have been seeing articles lately casting a poor reflection on low carb and/or keto way of eating stating that they cause an increase in afib potential, I think around 16% increase? ...

I went on a low carb/ketogenic programme in January of 2020, and went off it 10 months later at Christmas. My recent AF troubles, the ones that had me pursuing ablation after four good years, came a year after going off of the low carb/ketogenic regimen. So, at least in my case, you could argue that going off a low-carb/ketogenic regimen increases the risk of aggravated AF. It's a post hoc problem.

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LaDonna
...Trouble is being overweight is also an issue for afib...

Yes, although we're still in the post hoc maze. Did your weight cause other problems, or is it, itself, due to other comorbidities? Did your AF come as a result of being overweight, or do you happen to have sleep apnea (If you say no, how do you know?)? It is true, though, that excessive weight places a strain on the heart, and that the strain, in turn, can cause palpitations and arrhythmias.

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LaDonna

... I am wanting to ask of those here that are low carb or keto if you feel that this has been or may be an issue for you? or on the flip side if either way of eating (low carb / keto) has been a blessing for you and help your afib? thank you, I look forward to learning your experience as it helps me to make decisions for myself.

As my weight grew, I found it harder to bend over and tie my shoes. I was belching incessantly. It was annoying, not least of to my wife who was trying to watch TV not a meter away. I had a flare-up of AF, but it was almost gone by the time the lab called and waved a Holter Monitor at me. It wasn't until seven months later, in September of last year (2021) that I had my first protracted episode, but also a sustained rapid HR over 130. It went away after a day or so, and it wasn't until March of this year that I began to slide into more frequent and intrusive bouts of AF. My weight has been stable for about 17 months now. So, for me, my weight loss or gain has had little impact on my disorder's progression. It seems to be on its own schedule.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/15/2022 02:24AM by gloaming.

Ah.. thank you again so much everyone for sharing thoughts and continue to hop on anyone else who cares to share/comment. The uniquenss of each persons journey is so helpful. To see the commonalities and differences, its good (and not good) to connect. I dont know that there is any connection for me for sure with weight so to speak. However, I am looking at inflamation being a key factor possibly, and I know that diet and life choices can have a big impact their. For instance if I have a tendancy towards RA or athritis or other inflamatory conditions in the body or for that matter some kind of autoimmune response? Its good to try to figure out how to make better choices and what those choices are so that our body has a fighting chance to feel better, whether or not its "a cure" Over all I just want to be my best, yet still enjoy life and feel good.

I eat whatever I want and have a BMI of 21.9. 6' tall and 162 lbs, age 77. So what's the secret. Likely some heredity, but it comes down to calories in and calories out. I eat 4 times a day, but small portions. Exercise 6 times a week (golf, weights, walking, swimming, windsurfing). The greater the muscle mass, the greater the calorie burn.

I found no relationship between diet and afib, but I do supplement with magnesium, potassium and Taurine and blood tests show high normal levels of magnesium and potassium. I see no need for any special diets.

My good friend encouraged me to go Keto, she's been on for years to maintain her weight but within 3 weeks I had 2 very scary afib episodes,. My Afib had been well controlled up until then with Flecanide. Whether I went into a Keto regime too fast, or didn't supplement with enough minerals, potassium, whatever, I stopped. Besides, not eating fruit except for a few berries a day didn't seem healthy. In my experience, Weight loss is how many calories you have everyday. And it's usually 1000-1200 for most women to lose weight with moderate exercise.

It isn't so simple, Lois. Yes, it is physically a balanced equation of calories intaken vs. calories expended. The keto world maintains that you're going to increase the intake, even with the same amount of food, if you eat more carbs than you should. This is because the insulin produced as your serum sugars rise will cause the body to store what it can't use immediately. If you don't produce insulin, BUT ALSO control your carb intake, your problem with insulin diminishes commensurately. Lower levels of insulin = less adipose tissue with accepted fat deposition.

The key to weight loss is not calorific content, but calorific retention. If you burn more of what you intake due to exercise or basal metabolic rate, you're going to lose weight until you come up against whatever your 'set point' is (which you can alter through activity or simply by aging). If you control your carb calorie ratio to either fats or protein, you'll have less insulin working in you to force your adipocytes to store fat lipids.

It happens that the heart is up to 18% more efficient on keto energy than it is on glucose.

It is indeed quite possible that you went to hard too fast. There is the keto hangover problem when one not used to skirting ketosis, or actually in ketosis, first enters that state. It's not fun, and yes, electrolytes are quickly going to become a problem. As other stuff is flushed by your kidneys in the novel state, your kidneys also expel copious quantities of salts and minerals. It is well known that those on a ketogenic diet should supplement daily with electrolytes. Most can get this with those marvelous fillers...lettuce, spinach, etc. And, having to eat large amounts of such foods happens to be good for you for other reasons.

What most can't get past is that you can eat enormous quantities of fats and protein and actually maintain or lose weight. This is the proof that insulin is the 'pest' for those who can't control their weight and who weigh too much. Fats and protein don't produce the insulinic response that carbs do. Proteins do produce a mild insulin response, but very little.

Finally, fruit. Berries are okay. Sweet fruit like mangos, apples, pineapple....they're far too carb-dense to be nearly as good for you as are blackberries (#1), raspberries (#2), strawberries (#3), and carefully controlled eating of blueberries. Additionally, all fruits have as their primary insulin inducer the sugar called fructose. This one sugar is hardest on the liver, and only the liver can convert it to usable form.

[www.health.harvard.edu]

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gloaming
Additionally, all fruits have as their primary insulin inducer the sugar called fructose. This one sugar is hardest on the liver, and only the liver can convert it to usable form.

The liver processes fructose through the same pathways as ethanol, just no high is induced. This can be a primary cause of fatty liver. Work done at the Newcastle Magnetic Resonance Centre in the UK has shown that a relatively few grams of fat in the pancreas can be a cause of T2 diabetes. This is a lay summary of reversing T2 through their approach.

My GP, educated at an Ivy League medical school has an additional degree in nutrition. He told me to always eat a carb with a protein.

^ reason being?

I see him Monday, I’ll ask. I recalled from his advice in 2006 the answer was similar to the second link regarding insulin resistance. I lost the weight using an app in which I calculated my diet for the day based on carbs proteins and veggies (I’m dairy free) . I calculated my daily diet in advance (easier) and I didn’t stray. Being anal helped keeping my control of what I ate. I brought my scale with me if I ate out.

I used the app “MyFitnessPal “…free version at the time but it still works even without using their monthly premium plan. I use the nutrition section and set a goal. For me it was 90g protein, 120g carbs, 45g sugar (from veggies and fruit), 40g total fat. I suggest you ask your dr for recommendations on how much grams you need.

I googled in the meantime:

[www.joslin.org]
[mghdiabeteseducation.com]
[www.shopfamilyfare.com]
[www.promaxnutrition.com]

This link has a negative view of food combining:
[www.livestrong.com]

I understand the science behind Keto, as much as a non scientific person can and I know my friend seems healthy and keeps weight off. But she has cut out 50% of the foods she used to love and her monk sugar sweets have an aftertaste although they can be loaded with cream cheese, nuts, cocolate, etc.. I guess I'd rather cut back than cut out so many foods I love.

Sweeten with stevia. Or whatever low-call/low-carb sweetener gives you and her the pleasure you crave. I hate Splenda. It's like a lollipop with only sweet, no taste. For me, even though the science of late suggests its among several not good for the gut biome, I prefer my coffee with Sugar Twin (sodium cyclamate....which, along with MSG and fat, have been given bogus bum raps decades ago by 'research' sponsored by competing industries).

Yuh gotta live. Just be mindful, find things that work, be disciplined, learn lots, and experiment. About the only fly in a life's ointment is a closed mind.

Yes you have to live but if you get reactions or are allergic sometimes it’s not worth the 10 minutes of pleasure for a sudden bloated 8 month pregnancy belly vomiting and runs in pain or tachycardia from other foods or a rash if the food contains iodized salt. I’m allergic to 152 foods. A few dozen foods will be very symptomatic while the rest I just tolerate the side effects and eat them sparingly as a treat.

It’s not worth it. I don’t just “think” I’m allergic. Biopsies and allergy testing confirmed my symptoms.

I do miss eating out like a regular person. I have a few restaurants I can actually enjoy the meal instead of considering it survival food…or I just join friends and family and drink water and eat a snack from my purse.

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susan.d
I see him Monday, I’ll ask. I recalled from his advice in 2006 the answer was similar to the second link regarding insulin resistance. I lost the weight using an app in which I calculated my diet for the day based on carbs proteins and veggies (I’m dairy free) . I calculated my daily diet in advance (easier) and I didn’t stray. Being anal helped keeping my control of what I ate. I brought my scale with me if I ate out.

I used the app “MyFitnessPal “…free version at the time but it still works even without using their monthly premium plan. I use the nutrition section and set a goal. For me it was 90g protein, 120g carbs, 45g sugar (from veggies and fruit), 40g total fat. I suggest you ask your dr for recommendations on how much grams you need.

I googled in the meantime:

[www.joslin.org]
[mghdiabeteseducation.com]
[www.shopfamilyfare.com]
[www.promaxnutrition.com]

This link has a negative view of food combining:
[www.livestrong.com]

Thanks Susan! Agree, the second link is probably what he is saying.
Solution to the confusion is a CGM.