Does AF itself cause myocardial fibrosis?

Hoping someone knows this already - does having AF cause myocardial fibrosis in the same way an MI does? (but over time/cumulative)

Is remodeling electrical signalling only in nature or could it be the increasing amount of fibrosis due to AF?

Thanks.

Hi NLAMA ... Yes, a number of cardiac conditions can result in increased degrees of cardiac structural fibrosis over time ... including chronic progressive AFIB.

Shannon

Thanks Shannon. Does persistent AF also prevent hs-crp levels from going down and result in a vicious cycle for AF?

I've been using a CPAP for a year now but crp levels still won't come down as low as I'd like.

Quote
NotLyingAboutMyAfib
Does persistent AF also prevent hs-crp levels from going down and result in a vicious cycle for AF?

Recall during my 2.5 month episode at the beginning of my afib journey, still had hsCRP of 0.5.

George I've been working down from 5 for more than a year now. Maybe 3.2 last time it was checked. I'll look and report back

Not Lying - About 15 years ago, I attended conference/Summit on Atrial Fibrillation or at the Cleveland Clinic (Cleveland, Ohio) hosted by Dr. Natale and cohorts. In one presentation, David Van Wagoner, PhD, spoke on the fibrosis topic. The topic of inflammation was a focus (so obviously) C-reactive Protein levels were discussed. There are several research reports online that are newer but the fundamental info is basically the same regarding the role of inflammation and atrial fibrosis. Your searches should focus on that along with the markers of inflammation including elevated C-reactive protein.

[www.ahajournals.org]

Ref: Dr. Van Wagoner: Inflammation is a primary cause of atrial fibrosis, and this can lead both to sinus node dysfunction and increased risk of AF. While you might expect anti-inflammatory drugs to uniformly reduce the incidence of AF, high dose steroid therapy has been shown to increase risk of AF, probably due to changes in the expression of ion channels that affect atrial electrical activity. Relevant references with links to PubMed are listed below.

M. K. Chung, D. O. Martin, O. Wazni, A. Kanderian, D. Sprecher, C. A. Carnes, J. A. Bauer, P. J. Tchou, M. Niebauer, A. Natale, and D. R. Van Wagoner. C-reactive protein elevation in patients with atrial arrhythmias: inflammatory mechanisms and persistence of atrial fibrillation. Circ. 104:2886-2891, 2001. PubMed

Also: Following are just a few of many URLs for this topic discussion here on the forum… just use the search feature for ‘all dates’ so you go back far enough in the archives. Here are a few links to past posts on the topic… there are many.

Check out posts from a number of years ago, on the topic of ‘Silent Inflammation’ and Risk of Stroke and MI…
Here’s a few links and you’ll find more with a search for that topic..

This one starts out with CRP
Red Flags to Beat the Odds - Reposted from 12/29/02 [www.afibbers.org]
[www.afibbers.org]

[a-fib.com]

Additionally…
Suggestions for lowering CRP include targeted nutritional supplements: such as Inflammatone…by Designs for Health… When my CRP was elevated, I used that and still do for preventive maintenance. Serrapeptase enzymes also helped lower.

[www.afibbers.org]

Just remember… whether it’s AF that you are aware of or other issues that accompany ‘silent inflammation’… it’s important to manage the elevated CRP and test to be sure you’re staying in the safe range.

Best to you.
Jackie

Jackie - thank you. I will look at all of that.

Initially, I was very excited as CPAP lowered CRP at a fast rate. But latest labs it was stable and still high. MD forgot to include in last lab set so this time it's a priority.

Jackie - wow overwhelmed. Those are the greatest posts ever on this subject. Everyone should read those. Just an awesome amount of information.

I am doing much of that advice already but not all (would that even be possible?).

Hoping next labs show some real progress - I am going to pull all old labs and list here.

hsCRP

August 2019 4.7
began using CPAP
September 3.4

More to come - still looking

Thanks for highlighting this, NLAMAF.

Jackie has always been a terrific researcher!

Thank you, NLAMAF and Larry G.

After several major medical errors in mis-diagnosing my symptoms related to two other 'ailments' (which were rooted in nutritional insufficiencies) and then suffering severe consequences as a result of that lack of knowledge. When I developed AF, I was determined not to have a repeat of those previous medical blunders. Fortunately, my AF ablation experiences with Dr. Natale have all been very positive.

I also was fortunate to become connected with a Harvard educated, Family Practice MD who was new to our area. He was introducing the practice of nutritional or functional medicine to the community. After he relocated, again, I found a Board Certified Family Practice MD who was also certified in Functional Medicine. She shared research resources and arranged for me to attend practitioner seminars which was a remarkable educational experience. We began with specific testing for nutritional status.

The body needs optimal and balanced specific nutrients for health and longevity. Drugs and chemicals prescribed to 'mask' symptoms do not typically restore what's lacking. To determine nutritional adequacy status, standard labs typically do not go far enough. For that reason, specialized labs offer in-depth analyses. Example: Genova Diagnostics’ NutrEval and Quest Diagnostics and (of course), ExaTest. And, there are others.

Depending on the test results, nutritional supplements are usually advised and dietary/lifestyle habits are assessed and monitored. It’s an ongoing process but important to remain ‘in balance.’ I certainly found that to be true once I learned from ExaTest that my Intracellular levels of Mg were low and the Ca was elevated and I continue to be attentive to that.

Wish you both good health and calm hearts,
Jackie