Long time sufferer, first time caller...

Hi Guys/Gals:

I'm hoping to maybe to get some comfort and advice from the collective expertise of my fellow a-fibbers.

Here's my history:
Diagnosed at 29 years old, currently 49yrs.
I can tell when I'm in AFIB
Episodes have lasted from 2 hours to 40 hours
Always have converted on their own.
Prescribed 80 MG Sotolol 2X per day, 1 baby aspirin.
Papone Ablation done Feb 2017
Active lifestyle, workouts 3-5 times per week, crossfit
Volunteer Firefighter
Triggers: Alcohol (But only if I get "sick" from too much, or if I exert myself with alcohol in my system)
Trigger 2: Sudden exertion accompanied by adrenaline

Here's where I am now, and where I need your help:

I have had AFIB for 20 years and under the care of one of the top cardiologists in New York the entire time. I stopped drinking 15 years ago and this reduced by incidents of Afib from once every 9 months, to being free of AFIB for 9 years!

I thought I had it beat.

6 years ago I became a Volunteer Firefighter.

Maximum exertion on this job, heavy gear, heavy stress, intense heat, literally life and death situations
Never ever went into AFIB under this conditions.

The problem I had was, when we got called out for a call, we drive to the firehouse and generally run or Jog to our rack to gear up.

This is where I started having AFIB attacks....but only for serious, anxiety producing calls...People trapped, etc. The cat in the tree type deals never gave me AFIB.

Keep in mind, this whole time, I was still going to the gym, 3-5 times a week, starting every session with a jog. Never ever got afib at the gym.

Because of the Fire Dept, I was going into AFIB every 9 months or so...not bad really. Would last 24-48 hours and go away on its own.

Doc recommended Pappone Ablation and was done in Feb 2017. Symptom free until October when a guy got trapped In a burning car, and whammo....Afib for 4 hours when I ran to my gear rack.

Anyway, managed to keep myself out of Afib for a couple of years, modifying my behavior.

Fast forward to now. Jogged to the gear rack, BS call, went into Afib, 4 hours.

I went to jog the other day, just to exercise...completely normal activity for me...went into afib for only 15 minutes.

Right now, I'm scared. I'm scared of losing my position as a Fire Fighter, which I love. I'm scared of not being able to work out anymore.

We went to go for a hike yesterday, and though nothing happened, it made me nervous when I knew the hike would cause me to exert myself.

Please help me figure out where I am.

Did the ablation "work" in that my episodes since then have been shorter?

Have I entered that phase where AFib comes on all the time for no reason?

Am I going to have to retire from the FD, quit training?

I have been taking Airborne every day since the Pandemic started just as a supplement. Could that be coming into play?

AFib may not neceissarily end my life but for the first time in 2 decades, I feel like the fear of AFib could ruin my life.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Hi, welcome to the forum. Sorry you found the need to join but you're in the right place.

A couple of questions....

What do you mean by a Pappone ablation? There is an EP named Carlo Pappone in Milan Italy. Do you mean he did the procedure?

What is Airborne?

Thanks for the reply:

The Ablation I had done was called a Pappone Ablation. Apparently, its named after the doctor in Italy who pioneered it. Bascially using a catheter to go from my groin to my heart and uses radio waves to burn away tissue.

Airborne is the over the counter supplement people take when they feel a cold coming on.

Interesting. I've never heard it called a Pappone ablation. What you had done is generally known as a pulmonary vein isolation (PVI) ablation or simply an RF ablation since PVI is the standard and has been for almost 20 years now.

Anyway, back to your question. Since your ablation was successful for years, that almost certainly means it hasn't failed but rather that you've developed a new source of AF that's outside the ablated areas. It's no surprise that adrenaline triggers it. Stress and adrenaline are triggers for many people.

I checked the ingredients in Airborne and there's a whole slew of stuff with unknown effects on AF, including licorice extract, which is known to promote arrhythmias. I would stop using that stuff immediately.

If the AF continues even after stopping the Airborne, you've got a few choices. You can do a repeat ablation, you can ask your cardiologist for an antiarrhythmic drug to prevent the episodes, or you can ask for an anti-anxiety med like Xanax since adrenaline seems to be your trigger. Personally, I wouldn't opt for that last choice. As bad as AF is, a benzo addiction is worse. The other things you can do are get your thyroid function checked and do a sleep study to rule out sleep apnea. And when's the last time you had a cardiac workup? If it's been years a stress test and/or echocardiogram might be a good idea to make sure nothing else is going on.

There are some other approaches you can try using various supplements, which you'll find plenty of discussion about here and more information in the library. Success with supplements is hit or miss, with some people swearing by certain things and others saying they did nothing for them. Personally, I don't think there are any supplements or health regimens that can cure AF. Improve it, yes, but not cure. Others will chime in on this shortly, I'm sure.

Wow, thanks a lot.

I really appreciate you taking the time to provide all that information.

It's very kind of you.

Once this Covid thing calms down, I'll go get the echo and other tests.

I stopped the airborne yesterday so hopefully that was the trigger.

Id be really interested in learning about supplements that seem to work for some people,

Thanks, again Carey.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/24/2020 05:13PM by jpizzo127.

Hi & welcome,

I've had afib for nearly 16 years and been on here since a month after my first episode. My path to afib was chronic fitness. Your presentation sounds like mostly a sympathetic trigger. Not that this matters once the afib starts. When afib starts during stress or exercise it can signal a sympathetic trigger. Vagal triggers from exercise are typically delayed. That being said, your chronic fitness may create an environment where the sympathetic trigger can act. As I posted here, I coached my 34 year old military son in law to train differently. A lot of Zone 2/MAF/nasal breathing (more info linked in my link) vs met con. I've been able to maintain my fitness at a pretty high level while controlling my afib for 15.5 years and this has been a significant part of it. My son in law started the approach that I linked in Dec and has had only one episode since. In fact, after switching to this training approach, he said he feels awesome, as does my non-afibber daughter, who adopted this training approach to support her husband. She told me she just did a 12 mile run and it felt effortless.

Also in my link are electrolyte supplements (magnesium and potassium) that have helped me and my son-in-law. Not saying any of this will solve your problem, but likely low risk to try. In my case, I've controlled the afib very well for the last 15.5 years and my recent stats are 2 episodes in the last 2 years (both converted with 300 mg flecainide in about an hour - if someone weighs less than 70 Kg (154 #'s) the dose would be 200 mg) with zero episodes in the last year. This is after having a 2.5 month episode within the first 4 months of having afib.

Good luck!

George

Hi George:

Thanks for all the information.

I am going to check out the links and maybe try your methods.

At some point, I'll have to have a conversation with my Cardio about Flec medication.

Thanks again.

Joe

I wonder if you are sweating out your electrolytes with all of the exercise and while fighting a fire? There is a good amount of potassium in a lot of foods, but especially coconut water and V8. Magnesium is harder to get from foods, so taking Magnesium glycinate, Mg taurate, or the liquid MgCl called Remag may help you. ReMag (Amazon) helped me for quite a while. On any magnesium, start with low dose and slowly increase it until you reach bowel tolerance, then cut back a bit and take that daily. Calcium and Sodium are EVERYWHERE, so you don't need to supplement those.

Quote
Lani Belisle
I wonder if you are sweating out your electrolytes with all of the exercise and while fighting a fire? There is a good amount of potassium in a lot of foods, but especially coconut water and V8. Magnesium is harder to get from foods, so taking Magnesium glycinate, Mg taurate, or the liquid MgCl called Remag may help you. ReMag (Amazon) helped me for quite a while. On any magnesium, start with low dose and slowly increase it until you reach bowel tolerance, then cut back a bit and take that daily. Calcium and Sodium are EVERYWHERE, so you don't need to supplement those.

This post needs a “like” button.

All true.