FYI

I was sharing this link on the powdered version of Doctor’s Best Magnesium Glycinate Chelate and am posting it in case you aren’t aware that iHerb has this powdered form. For those who don’t like taking a lot of capsules, this is ideal. It’s mildly sweet and mixes easily with water easily. Nice for home use. This is the bonafide Albion registered TRAACS version.

[www.iherb.com]

If you haven’t signed up with iHerb formally, read more here: [www.afibbers.org] so Shannon gets a small commission on your order to help with the expense of operating the forum. Every little bit helps!

Jackie

Just FYI….. I just learned that Doctor’s Best was sold to a Chinese company last year.
[www.nutraingredients-usa.com]

Not sure of the details for where the products are manufactured, here or off shore, and how
the quality control assurance is affected. iHerb does carry other brands of the
powdered bisglycinate chelated magnesium… such as Healthy Origins
as one example: [www.healthyorigins.com]

Also not sure how to determine where supplement ingredients are actually sourced but
the one important criteria for the magnesium amino acid chelate version should be labeled
as either:
Albion Labs (patented formulations)
TRAACS® ( The Real Amino Acid Chelate System) so that you know you have the true chelate for optimal absorption

A number of years ago, I attended a conference that included a presentation on the process of manufacturing supplements and quality assurance. Some of the points of concern revealed at that time were the impurities incorporated into products when made from locally-sourced (off-shore) raw materials used in the products such as problems with plants gown locally in contaminated soils that accumulated heavy metals, sewage, local water with the same contamination, less than sanitary production facilities, equipment, and quality control inspection/certification before packaging, bottling etc.

In the US, the GMP guidelines are standard and reputable manufacturers/bottlers indicate GMP compliant practices on labels.

Good Manufacturing Practice regulations are promulgated by the United States Food and Drug Administration under the authority of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act

I’m not sure if the absence of GMP from a label means the products inside were not made in the USA, or if the bottler didn’t apply for the certification to permit that labeling.

If I learn more, I'll post.

Jackie

Quote
Jackie
Just FYI….. I just learned that Doctor’s Best was sold to a Chinese company last year.

Sigh... there goes another good source. Thanks for posting this. I won't take drugs/supplements manufactured in China because, quite frankly, their track record with food and drug safety is miserably bad.

Damn it, This formulation of Mg was (is) working for me like a charm, and now I have to switch. On top of that, I just recommended the brand to my 71 year old mother, who was just diagnosed last week with AF. My dad got it at age 51. (Hint - anyone who thinks this thing doesn’t have a hereditary factor is, well, WRONG!!!)

Diligence is always the answer. Thank God for this website.

I've successfully used di-magnesium malate powder (20% mag by weight) from an equine source for ~ 7 years <[shop.performanceequinenutrition.com] Chatted with the lady who runs this shop at the time. It is made by Albion and is the same stuff marketed for humans (it helps my "marish" behaviour... )

Any mag works for me as long as I take it in sufficient quantity.

Recently decided to try magnesium hydroxide (milk of magnesia) plain (and you want it with nothing but plain water & the mag when you buy it). I've used it for years to make magnesium bicarbonate (by reacting with carbonated water to make magnesium bicarbonate water "Waller Water" as well as magnesium acetate (reacting in a 2:7 ratio with organic apple cider vinegar to make make the mag acetate - which converts to bicarb in the body). Decided to try the plain stuff for use during multiday fasting. My objective is autophagy & the chelated or organic compounds might inhibit this. So I'd fast with only distilled water, sodium chloride salt & magnesium hydroxide.

Waller Water: <[www.afibbers.org]
Magnesium Acetate <[www.dropbox.com]

It's not a matter of it working or not. It's a matter of purity. The Chinese have a dismal quality control record. If they can't be trusted to manufacture baby formula that doesn't contain toxins added to reduce cost, what can they be trusted with?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/07/2017 03:37PM by Carey.

Agree w/ Carey. Even if they don't change the Mg formulation there's still a HUGE risk that either the pills themselves or the bottles and packaging could have significant contamination with other toxins. There are no rules in the wild, wild, East. Bribe the right officials and you could ship lead and cyanide to your customers. Just look at all the dead dogs from Chinese pet treats a few years ago.

Quote
GeorgeN
I've successfully used di-magnesium malate powder (20% mag by weight) from an equine source for ~ 7 years <[shop.performanceequinenutrition.com] Chatted with the lady who runs this shop at the time. It is made by Albion and is the same stuff marketed for humans (it helps my "marish" behaviour... )

dl=0

Tried that stuff but started stamping my hooves.

Murray L

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tikosyn uptake Dec 2011 500ug b.i.d. NSR since!
Herein lies opinion, not professional advice, which all are well advised to seek.

Hello Murray! Good to see you posting. How are you?

Jackie

Quote
Murray L

I've successfully used di-magnesium malate powder (20% mag by weight) from an equine source for ~ 7 years <[shop.performanceequinenutrition.com] Chatted with the lady who runs this shop at the time. It is made by Albion and is the same stuff marketed for humans (it helps my "marish" behaviour... )

dl=0

Tried that stuff but started stamping my hooves.

Hilarious!!

I have been using Doctor's Best for the past 2 years too. Also has been effective in stopping retinal migraines for me

If anyone has an alternative please let me know!

Que - I listed the Healthy Origins product that is also at iHerb... and it's the same patented Albion Magnesium amino acid chelated version but that link doesn't seem to be functional...

Try this one: at iHerb... [www.iherb.com]

It shows the TRAACS(r) identification on the label so you know you have the genuine product.

Jackie

I just ordered the Healthy Origins powder from iherb. I'll be switching as soon as it arrives. Here's hoping it works well!

It's unclear where Healthy Origins, like Dr's Best, will be manufactured in the near future. It is interesting that older Healthy Origins web blurbs assert they are a US based manufacturer, while currently they only assert they are a US based distributor

In any case, such claims pertain only to manufacturing, and the ingredients can be sourced from anywheres, without a requirement to divulge their origin in a legally verifiable manner. I believe the purity of the ingredients and in particular the lack of contamination by toxic substances, is more important than the bottling, which admittedly is an opinion.

The fact is that the supplement industry is basically unregulated, something many consumer advocates have taken issue with, although it is an unpopular view in the holistic community who choose to believe that somehow the advocates are either naive or manipulated by big pharma. Now in view of the increasing pace of outsourcing manufacturing , it may have been more prudent to support more regulation (and higher prices) to keep the manufacturing here.

I see no evidence the Healthy Origins or any other nonpharma grade Mg glycinate product is verifiably better than Dr's Best.

Quote
safib
I see no evidence the Healthy Origins or any other nonpharma grade Mg glycinate product is verifiably better than Dr's Best.

Exactly right. Without laboratory analysis by an independent organization, all supplements are equally suspect and all are likely sourced from countries with even less regulatory oversight than the US.

Quote
Carey

all supplements are equally suspect and all are likely sourced from countries with even less regulatory oversight than the US.

What will everyone do then? Trust in Dr's Best in pill or powder form or someone else or perhaps stop taking them altogether? I credit the Mg and LSV8 with lessening my PVC's post Natale ablation.

safib - The GMP designation (at least in the past) offers a degree of quality assurance. Many of the generic brands don't label GMP......some professional bottlers do and typically include quality control assurances and assays.

At least the The Healthy Origins has the Albion (TRAACS) patented designation. Also, Klaire Labs professional grade magnesium glycinate capsules are available online and they are labeled GMP and ISO. I trust Klair Labs and have used their products for years.
[www.amazon.com]

Not sure, but I believe that Albion and similar who patent the compounded material also supply the raw material to bottlers.... but not aware of further blending/bottling procedures including assays of the the end product which qualifies for the designation on the labels.


ABPage - you can always make the magnesium bicarbonate concentrate for home use as an excellent source of magnesium. The only problem I see is who makes the Milk of Magnesia and if their product is also produced in China.

However, Adobe Springs in California does bottle their magnesium water so if you live near there, that's a jackpot source. [www.mgwater.com]

Making the WW concentrate at home is undoubtedly far less costly and convenient source of a highly beneficial, bicarbonate ion form.

Life Extension reports on Adobe Springs and founder, Paul Mason.
[www.lifeextension.com]

Jackie

Quote
Jackie
you can always make the magnesium bicarbonate concentrate for home use as an excellent source of magnesium. The only problem I see is who makes the Milk of Magnesia and if their product is also produced in China.
Jackie

Thanks Jackie, that's an option I forgot about. Sure hope a trusted American sourced and manufactured pill form can be identified as I typically take them mid-morning and afternoon. I could always mix it at work, but the pill form factor is convenient.

Anybody know what it would take to get a US lab to assay any of these products? If the cost were acceptable, I'd be willing to contribute to such an effort.

Maybe the government won't do it, but who says a consumer-based group can't?

Quote
wolfpack
Anybody know what it would take to get a US lab to assay any of these products? If the cost were acceptable, I'd be willing to contribute to such an effort.

Maybe the government won't do it, but who says a consumer-based group can't?

I have no idea, but I'd be willing to contribute. Seems we'd need somewhat regular testing from random samples I'd think that the member's here own supply could satisfy.

Anyone else interested or have a line on a lab that does testing?

My first thought would be a university with a biochemistry department. My alma mater comes to mind.

Wolfpack -

Yes - I'm interested in investigating......but lots of issues to sort out on this topic. We could be nit-picking some minor details if the bottlers have GMP and other in-house testing procedures in place as quality assurance practices. However, because so many afibbers are highly sensitive to various chemicals which can act as triggers...especially if cumulative, it makes sense for us to be aware and have useful, helpful information for guidance.

I think the overall conundrum comes from the fact that consumers don't really know the source of the raw materials used in supplements and I'm not sure how or if that would ever be disclosed... so the quality, In-house Testing such as from the professional grade products by Designs for Health (for example) may be a typical standard... or it may be quite a bit higher than many or most bottlers. It could be that the raw material ingredients are shipped in from undisclosed sources including off-shore and may or not be subject to purity/contaminant screening. But, I’d certainly hope there would be documentation. I've seen some labels on herbals indicating the country of origin.

Here with Doctor's Best, we just happen to know that Drs. Best was sold to a Chinese company but in reality, we never knew where their raw material components were sourced in the past or if something will change in the future.. similar to some of the conscientious labeling of imported food in packages or cans that state on the label where the product was grown or ‘caught’… like sardines … “Wild-Caught in Portugal with the can marked BPA free.”

The Doctor’s Best magnesium bisglycinate chelate product has always irritated me because the label indicates the inclusion of magnesium oxide and it’s often labeled as ‘buffered.’ And there is no reason a true Albion patented magnesium glycinate chelate needs to be buffered (to protect against stomach acid degredation) because the patented chelate bond, itself, prevents that from occurring. I’ve always felt it was a way to dilute the content for economics but still charge the higher ‘chelate’ price. There are the true Albion magnesium amino acid chelate products that do not have the magnesium oxide included.

Also, there is no mention of how much (percentage wise) of the overall magnesium is the oxide form. Why add it to the patented formulation? It’s long been established that the oxide form of magnesium has a very low absorption property… meaning that we won’t benefit from that form of magnesium. If the percentage of oxide as ‘filler’ is significant, then that makes the product less than desirable compared to one that lists the only ingredient as the Albion patented magnesium bisglycinate or glycinate chelate.... regardless of where it is sourced.

However…. The fact remains that knowing where the raw materials are sourced …USA or off-shore sources… is something that needs to be addressed on labels. Many foods sourced from off shore are labeled as such; but not typically supplements. So to put this in perspective, just think about various food contaminants, for a moment… specifically LS-V8 as an example... that we might consume without a thought to the impurities.

The veggies included may not be thoroughly washed before blended into the formula. They can be covered with pesticide residues and other contaminants -- from farming; trucking, handling or from the importation process where they are fumigated with chemicals (by law) at the border. Residues such as arsenic and lead are common residues as is glyphosate. And even if organic, if not US grown, fumigation chemicals are going into the final product. And same goes for veggies and fruit that are not organic but, US grown. Those toxins will be in those items as well. USA grown, Organic Veggie juice has the best chance not to contain trace toxic elements. Then there’s the packaging material, such as can coating – BPA -- which has known toxicity versus safer glass bottles is another source of toxic residues.

So, there are multiple factors to which we are exposed regularly unless we are keenly aware of sourcing and organic food and so on.

I’m looking into what some of supplement bottlers have in their policy for their purity assays.

These are a few of the listings for Designs for Health…

In House Testing

At Designs for Health we take the added measure of testing our raw materials and finished products throughout the manufacturing process. Our team of In-House lab professionals test for the following:

• Toxins - All of our raw materials are tested to ensure pesticides, heavy metals and other toxins are not present
• GC Testing - Gas Chromatography is a instrument used to test raw herbs for toxins
• Potency - Used to determine the percentage of purity present in a raw material
• HPLC Testing - High Performance Liquid Chromatography (HPLC) is an instrument for potency testing used to determine raw material purity
• Microbial - Both raw materials and finished product blends are tested to make sure there is no microbial contamination.

The test consists of: total plate count, yeast and molds, E coli, staphylococcus, salmonella species, and USP testing methodology.
• Even Blending - Once mixed, ingredients are tested by either HPLC or GC to ensure blend homogeneity in our finished products
• FT-IR Testing - Fourier transform infrared spectroscopy (FTIR) allows us to track any changes in our raw materials from lot to lot. Identity testing is an aspect of the FTIR Testing, used mainly for incoming raw materials.

Another example is their GMP specifications:
Vendor Qualification Program
Designs for Health supplements are manufactured in select facilities that have met our stringent quality standards. Every Designs for Health vendor must undergo a formal qualification process to evaluate procedures and activities related to the manufacture, packaging, and holding of Designs for Health dietary ingredients and finished dietary supplements. Key elements of the qualification process include:
• Vendor evaluation
• Documentation review
• Evaluation of Standard Operating Procedures, i.e., manufacturing controls and processes
• Existence of a Designs for Health-approved testing and monitoring program for raw materials and finished products

Good Manufacturing Practices (GMPs)
We fully guarantee that our products are produced utilizing the highest standards of manufacturing. Each product is evaluated and monitored for quality throughout the manufacturing process.
Specifically, we guarantee that every Designs for Health nutritional supplement...
• Contains only qualified, superior raw materials
• Meets required specifications for quality and purity
• is evaluated and monitored for potential contaminants such as filth, heavy metals, pesticides, and microbiological organisms (Designs for Health packaging is also monitored to ensure against contamination)
• is analyzed to confirm the quantity of all dietary ingredients, thereby ensuring the consistency and accuracy of our label claims
• is manufactured at FDA inspected facilities with stringent internal quality control procedures and documentation systems that conform to one or more of these industry standards and/or certifications: NPA (Natural Products Association), NSF (National Sanitary Foundation), OTC (Over the Counter Drug GMPs), TGA (Australian Therapeutic Goods Administration), and the requirements of the FDA Dietary Supplement Good Manufacturing Practices (GMPs)

If we could do a query to some of the more popular brands about their quality control standards, we may be able to learn if we are concerned over nothing... or the opposite. Because I have the MCS problem, I tend to use professional grade products such as the DFH line and the higher-quality brands such as Orthomolecular, Natural Factors which has very high quality control standards and many others. The topic is certainly important for not only the supplements we ingest but also our food and beverages.

Jackie

I would contribute to independent lab testing.

Thanks

Perhaps this is a good option?

I found this on a compounding pharmacy site here in SF that has a very good reputation.

[www.koshlandpharm.com]

[www.integrativepro.com]

I emailed Klaire Labs regarding their Magnesium Glycinate Capsules and they said

Magnesium bisglycinate chelate is sourced in the USA



Customer Service
SFI USA
795 Trademark Drive
Reno, NV 89521

TF 888-488-2488
P 775-850-8800
F 775-850-8810
E CustomerServiceUSA@sfihealth.com

Que - Thanks for this. It’s good to see you reference the Klaire Labs line of professional-quality nutraceuticals. I've used their magnesium glycinate bulk powder for years. I like the bulk powder because it eliminates the many other additives and compounds added for various reasons with capsules. Capsules are handy for travel so I use those as well. At least with Klaire, we know the quality assurance/GMP standards are in place.

I think it’s very important for us to do collaborative research and share what we learn about purity, quality and GMP products produced here in the US using US raw materials.

Jackie