Would L-Citrulline cause Afib?

I'm having trouble walking even short distances as I get a build up of pressure with slight pain in the chest. This happens even with a gentle stroll which doesn't increase my heart rate or breathing.

Interestingly I can do fairly light weight training which does increase heart rate and breathing with no ill effects.

My cardiologist doesn't think it's angina but admits to not knowing what it is. He still wants to do a dye test which I don't want to do.

I've been using the Linus Pauling protocol for clogged arteries (high dose Vit c + Lycine) with no change seen.

I've also been increasing Nitric Oxide levels through humming and am now considering adding L-Citrulline.

Which brings me (at last you say) to my question - does anyone know whether this supplement is likely to bring on an Afib episode?

Thanks

Sam

Hi Sam -

You probably know this, but for other readers: The amino acid citrulline is precursor to arginine which, via specific enzymes, produces nitric oxide (NO) causing small blood vessels to relax thus increasing blood flow. That's the basics of the book NO More Heart Disease by Louis Ignarro PhD [www.amazon.com] Dr. Ignarro 'was co-recipient of the 1998 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine with Robert F. Furchgott and Ferid Murad' [en.wikipedia.org].

See also The Healing Nutrients Within: Facts, Findings, and New Research on Amino Acids, Chapter 9: Arginine and Its Metabolites: The Cholesterol Fighters [www.amazon.com]
Quote: Major interest in Arginine has focused on its role as precursor to the neurotransmitter nitric oxide (NO). . . It helps to regulate the dilation and constriction of small blood vessels and plays a crucial role in the treatment of peripheral vascular and cardiovascular conditions throughout the entire body.

A very informative video on this by Dan Hammer: [www.youtube.com]
Dan Hammer, Professor U. of Pennsylvania: [www.seas.upenn.edu]
Hammer Laboratories: [hammerlab.weebly.com]

Have fun, be well !

Erling Mørk



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/20/2016 05:00PM by Moerk.

Thanks Erling... you beat me to it.

Sam - I have been using the NO protocol (by Ignaro) and also switched from L-arginine to L-citrulinne without any negative effects. I can only surmise that these are working to help "as advertised" in a positive way to keep blood vessels relaxed and open.

Jackie

one should read this caution first
[www.mlmwatch.org]

Jackie, are you in a timewarp or has Erling resumed posting under the name Moerk?

PeggyM

I read colindo's reference. It's always good to be cautious and consider all sides to a subject.

However in this case the positive comments on the use and value of Nitric Oxide are from a man who won a Nobel Prize for his work on this nutrient while the negative comments are from a retired Psychiatrist.

Not difficult to choose is it?

A point about Quackwatch. When I first saw this site I thought it was an excellent idea. A completely neutral examination of medical claims. I was soon disillusioned when I looked at what it said about a subject in which I'm an expert (forgive the immodesty, please) i.e. Manipulative Therapy. The site is anything but neutral and not worth a second glance.

Regarding Citrulline I think I have my answer. Like Nitric Oxide it lowers blood pressure. I already suffer from low blood pressure and while I'm managing all right with the humming for NO I fear and added supplement to lower it even further would be too much.

But thank you all for your comments

Sam

Hi Sam - I agree not only with your assessment of Quackwatch but also agree with your concern about lowering blood pressure even more.

My blood pressure is typically about 100/65 -68... (depending on when it's recorded) and I'm careful not to use too much of either arginine or citrulline at one time. I have not found any adverse effects with my specific precautions.

The founder, of QW, Steven Barrett, was exposed long ago as fraudulent, himself.

Stephen Barrett, founder of Quackwatch, is a delicensed medical doctor. In addition, he failed the medical board exam required for a psychiatrist. His using the "MD" after his name is misleading and even fraudulent. He has never performed scientific research, nor written a scientific paper, but yet discredits Nobel Prize scientists such as Dr. Otto Warburg and Dr. Linus Pauling. Stephen Barrett is one BIG QUACK who is financed by the pharmaceutical industry that makes quack medicine. He was deemed "unworthy of credibility" in a court of law. Therefore, all his writings are medical quackery. There should be a picture of Stephen Barrett beside the words "nutcase" and "con artist" in the dictionary.

Quackwatch, www.quackwatch.com, (originally Lehigh Valley Committee Against Health Fraud, Inc.) is an AMA (American Medical Association) shill that took over from the Coordinating Conference on Health Information (CCHI) and the AMA's propaganda department called the Committee on Quackery when it had to disband ref: Lisa. It only promotes and defends Allopathic (drugs) medicine while attacking non-Allopathic.

Very interesting reports on Stephen Barrett : [www.encognitive.com]

Jackie



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2016 12:21PM by Jackie.

Jackie, got your message. So this is another Erling, not our old friend. Moerk, please pardon me for mistaking you for our own Erling. I guess perhaps it is not unusual for scandinavians to have this name. Like Hans, another name held by many people. Oh well, another misconception killed by fact.

PeggyM

Hi Sam,

I very much doubt the NO protocol would lower your BP 'even further', but what it will do is open (dilate) your heart's blood vessels to increase oxygen to your heart muscle cells in the way nature intends, thus relieving the angina you report, which you are already trying to do with the Linus Pauling protocol of high dose Vit.C and lycine. Your Pauling protocol should add the amino acid proline as recommended by Dr. Matthias Rath in Practicing Medicine Without a License? The Story of The Linus Pauling Therapy for Heart Disease by Owen Fonorow of the Vitamin C Foundation: [www.amazon.com]

========

Chapter 7 quotes:

For those diagnosed with cardiovascular disease, Linus Pauling recommended taking 5,000 to 6,000 mg of lysine daily.
He recommended supplementing with at least 2,000 mg daily for prevention.
The following excerpt is from the Unified Theory lecture. Linus Pauling relates the story of his invention of the Pauling therapy for cardiovascular disease, which was to add lysine to vitamin C. Dr. Pauling explains what happened in the case of the first person to try the therapy, a distinguished anonymous scientist who had asked Pauling for advice. The scientist was on disability, in pain, and generally unable to do work or exercise despite taking 5,000 mg of vitamin C daily. He asked Linus what else he might recommend for his cardiovascular disease, and Dr. Pauling recounts his own response as follows:

I didn’t have to tell him that lysine is an essential amino acid and you have to get around a gram a day to be in good health, and you get it in your foods, because he is one of the most distinguished biochemists in the United States, recipient of the National Medal of Science in the United States. So he said, “How much shall I take?” I thought, “What do I know?” I know that people get a gram or two in their food depending upon how much meat and fish they eat, that it’s essential, that they have to get around one gram. It hasn’t any known toxicity in animals or human beings. I said, “5 grams, 5 grams of lysine per day.” He thanked me. A couple of months later he telephoned me and said “It's almost miraculous! I started taking a gram a day and 2 grams and so on. Within a month after I had reached 5 grams a day of lysine in addition to my 5 grams of vitamin C, I could walk two miles without any nitroglycerin tablets or without any pain in the chest.” He said he had cut down the amount of heart medicine in half. “It’s almost miraculous,” he said.
Another couple of months went by and he telephoned me and said, “I was feeling so good the other day that I
cut down a big tree in our yard and was chopping it up for wood, and I was also painting the house, and I got chest
pains,” this despite his 5 grams of vitamin C and lysine. So he said that he “went up to 6 grams of lysine and 6
grams of vitamin C and told me, “Now I am continuing chopping down, chopping up the tree and painting the
house.” And now a couple of years later he is still in fine health.

Linus Pauling
[Transcribed from his 1993 Linus Pauling Unified Theory Lecture]

3. Follow Linus Pauling’s general heart and cardiovascular nutritional recommendations as provided in his 1986 book, How to Live Longer and Feel Better. [www.amazon.com]

In addition to 6,000 to 18,000 mg of vitamin C, Linus Pauling advised:
Vitamin E - 800 IU (to 3,200 IU)
Vitamin A - 20,000 to 40,000 IU
Super B-Complex - one or two Daily multiple vitamin/mineral supplement
Eat less sugar
Drink plenty of water
Matthias Rath Recommendations

4. Take 250 to 2,000 mg of the amino acid proline daily. This nutrient is an addition to the original Linus Pauling protocol. Dr. Rath specifically recommends the amino acid proline because of its strong Lp(a) binding inhibitor properties in vitro (in test tube experiments). There is anecdotal evidence that proline supplements lower elevated Lp(a) over a period of 6 to 14 months. It is difficult to suggest an optimum dose for everyone because the healthy body manufactures its own proline, though we probably make less as we age. A few alternative doctors have recommended 2 g (2,000 mg), although the first Pauling therapy formula, Tower's Heart Technology™, has produced consistently good results with 400 mg per serving. Two servings daily (800 mg of proline) were shown to lower Lp(a) in a small pilot study.

========

Erling



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/20/2016 07:51PM by Moerk.

Oh thank you Jackie for saving me the trouble of again digging up the dirt on Stephen Barrett. Memorable is his destructive agenda in support of water fluoridation, and against noted biochemist John Yiamouyiannis PhD's work on exposing the criminal fluoridation of our waters, as described at [www.whale.to]

Please don't tell me the fluoridation topic doesn't belong on this AF forum, as no single thing is more destructive of the heart's ability to maintain NSR. Here are the biophysics/ biochem details of why that is so:

Quote: "John Yiamouyiannis, in his influential 'Fluoride - The Aging Factor', described how the fluorine ion disrupts enzyme activity and attacks DNA and protein. In his theories, backed up by research, the fluorine ion particularly disrupts hydrogen bonds. When chemicals are dumped together, the elements that have a higher bonding affinity will "steal" the bonds from other elements. Because it holds its electrons more tightly than any other element, fluorine forms the smallest negatively charged ions of all the elements, and that small size allows them to go where larger ions cannot. Those fluorine ions can get into the nooks and crannies of larger molecules, such as enzymes and DNA, and wreak biological havoc. Those fluorine ions disrupt weaker bonds in those larger molecules, damaging or destroying the original substance, disabling its biochemical usefulness. The fluorine ion acts similarly to "free radicals" in the body, with its net electrical charge interfering with biochemical reactions. That is how the fluorine ion harms or kills people."
(full text: [ahealedplanet.net]

All heart muscle cell membrane ion channels and pumps (enzymes) are proteins, their disruption/ destruction by fluoride (fluorine ion) disrupts the heart's normal workings, worst case may stop its workings altogether.

Erling Mørk



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2016 06:08AM by Moerk.