Atrial runs

In the recovery room after my second ablation, I started having what I was told were atrial runs. My heart rate would jump up for a bit then back down. This went on all night. It has continued. The rate goes up like it is scrambling , then down, normal for a minute or two, then repeat pattern. Had a long period of this last night. Any experience with this? Lynda

Hi Lynda,

So you got your second ablation, good to hear, I bet you are glad its over with, did you return to Dr W? In any event, keep in mind this can all settle down over time during the blanking period.

I suppose what they mean by 'atrial runs', which is a rather non-specific term to be sure, is atrial tachycardia or flutter, perhaps runs of AFIB. The could even imply a lot of atrial PACS so its not an overly useful term to use and basically tells you nothing you didnt already know ... that you have some flippies still firing off in your chest of one sort or another..

It's still way too early to be concerned about possibly needing to get in line for round three. Obviously, the less activity early the better in terms of long term silence, but anything up to around 6 hours of total breakthrough time of actual atrial arrhythmia such as AFIB, Flutter or Tachycardia ( not including ectopic runs) is not considered to have much predictive value for confirming long term recurrence will likely happen.

However, once you get beyond 6 hours of total arrhythmia burden recent studies show that the odds of needing further work at some point increase substantially, at least at some point down the line, though often times it can go quiet for many months or even close to a year before things get cooking again when there is still more active trigger areas that need ablating, or re-ablation as some spots that act up right after an ablation can settle down and simply be stunned for some time by the current ablation if the lesion isn't a truly transmural and lasting one.

If it continues to rock and roll for more than two weeks for a good deal of the time, and starts to get going most of the time you should discuss getting an ECV to help reset the table, that can sometimes do the trick and put the house back in order for a good long while and let the ablation lesions solidify without a lot of annoying activity.

I had two very fast 45 minute atrial tachycardias from right around my LAA, as it turned out, and then Dr Natale put me on Sotalol and I was dead quiet for 11 months before BAM that same LAA tachycardia first appeared again just as Dr N said it was going to at some point. After getting a same day ECV I was totally quiet again for 14 more months before a big breakthrough at up to 200bpm as I was off all drugs and the tachy jumped immediately into hyperspace warp drive as soon as I bent over to pull open a lower draw in my closet. After that ECV a couple hours later in the local ER, things behalf for only 7 months before the ongoing cyclical pattern started in earnest of LAA tachy kicking in out of the blue with no warning whatsoever every 3 to 5 weeks like clockwork for the next 15 months.

I procrastinated much too long on that one trying this or that last combo of magnesium IV with soaking baths of mag oil and extra potassium and each of the nutrients in question, when the truth was, just as Dr Natale had said, when your Tachy or Flutter starts up in earnest again come in and well finish up the LAA isolation. I still thought I might be able to get the upper hand on it and then when I was set to get the ablation half way through that 15 month period my pacemakers battery had run down and I and to postpone the ablation to get the pacer changed first and it was another 7 months before I could get the LAA isolation finally taken care off.

Since I was already expert at the Strategy, I should have just given the addition wrinkle to the protocol no more than 3 months to shut things down or go right in for the touch up ablation and save myself about a half dozen or more shocks. Anyway, live and learn. There was ZERO chance an open LAA tachy flutter circuit is going to be quelled by electrolytes no matter how dedicated you are toward the program. Natale knew I was going to have to get it done, I subconsciously knew it, but I wanted to try one last step first etc etc..... Don't do this.

Im all for giving the nutritional restoration at least a good 6 months to a year at first when you have had no ablation and when there your arrhythmia is not so progressed.. But after an ablation and when you have been dedicated to good diet and nutritional repletion, I advocate a much shorter leash on any subsequent activity that you can completely arrest within at most 3 months. If you just slow it down but you are still getting a number of periodic breakthroughs, dont continue to fool yourself, thinking the next magic drug or supplement around the corner is going to do it.

Get it taken care of before too much additional remodeling take place, and then continue using a great diet and supplement protocol to help insure as quiet a heart as you can.

But in your case Lynn, just take it easy and let the healing happen and hopefully this will all quiet down for you for the long term with is entirely possible and you will be done with this business for good. I sure hope so!

Cheers!
Shannon

Shannon:

It appears to me from reading about the ablation reports on this site that women seem to have more problems after an ablation, anything to that?

Liz

Yes Liz,'

Women do statistically have a bit more challenges than men overall in some cases. Alas, women are more complicated creatures than men on many levels, or better I should say 'more complex', not necessarily 'more complicated' :-) ... certainly more nuanced and richly varied in emotional depth and expressiveness for the most part, and it seems with more complicated biology as well.

Women also tend to have smaller hearts and left atriums which, when extra small make getting to all the spots needed to seal everything off, especially when there are non-PV triggers near such hard to get places like the mitral annulus, Coronay Sinus, crista terminals and a few others it can put more demand on the ablationist to be very skilled.

Hence why I underline in bold my recommendation for women to not compromise on the quality of ablationist, especially if they have longer term AFIN whether it is paroxysmal or particularly persistent but either way, when you;ve had AFIB a long time and with longer duration episodes even when still paroxysmal, you will do better with an elite operator more times than not, than with a good ablations but one who may not be as experienced with such cases as the best you could have selected.

That really goes for men too who fit the same criteria for longer timers, but with women there is the little extra added emphasis due to the slightly more challenging nature of your overall and cardiac physiology.

Shannon



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2014 08:21PM by Shannon.

Thats exactly what I had post ablation couple weeks ago. Started when they gave me dinner in the hospital.
Had bouts of that for several days and then afib for a couple.

Thank you for your responses. Shannon,I had my second ablation two years ago in May. I just was curious if anyone else had experienced like symptoms and what they were told they were. If I have a third ablation, based on what I know now, it will be with Dr. Natale. Many thanks for responding to all of our inquiries, Shannon. You are a great care taker. Lynda