Anyone else get runs of hard ectopics?

I wrote about this a month ago. I started getting hard thumping ectopics that would come in groups 5,6 or more in a row. This really freaked me out and I went to the ER which called them multiforms PVCs. I saw my EP and had a holter done and he said it was all just PACs which was consistant with my condition.

They stopped for a while but I have been getting them at night for the last few days. They don't feel like I'm going into afib they just feel hard and uncomfortable and don't let me sleep.

I was using a beta blocker occasionally when I had ectopics and so I had been using it nightly for the last few weeks but became concerned that maybe it was making the problem worse so I stopped. So far no resolution.

Anyone get these or have any idea what they are? Just runs of pacs?

Monty

I am a definite layperson when it comes to these issues, but my sense of this is that it is a sign of low potassium. I use a Cardy Meter to confirm this. Simply supplementing with potassium is not real successful for me. Some consume V8. I have a bowl of corn flakes with a banana sliced and cocunut milk watered down with coconut water. But the real story may be that your potassium levels cannot be maintained until your magnessium levels are maintained.

I agree with RonB, the first thing to do would be to monitor your potassium levels, then you can adjust diet or supplements accordingly - you might want to look into getting a Cardymeter. If you are taking supplements, try eliminating them for a few days and see what happens - that has made a big difference for some of us in terms of ectopic reduction (then add back one at a time with sufficient time to check impact). Why would the ER diagnose as PVC's and the EP diagnose as PAC's? Both were likely accurate based on your situation at each particular time...multifocal PVC's too! That tells me you probably have a systemic problem which is likely due to something you might be able to control - that you are ingesting. CoQ10 causes me to have multi-focal PVC's, for example.

Tom

Tom,

Yeah the ECG from the ER scared me a little when I read that. It was just a computer print out and not interpreted by a cardiologist. My EP says that the computer frequently gets it wrong on several things and that he saw p waves but they were masked because they were on top of the t waves and not easily recognisable.

He did a holter so he should know. The ECG is a snapshot only and some weird stuff was happening at the time.

I guess what concerns me is that the ectopics are regular. A slow thump that lasts for up to 10 beats in a row and doesn't feel like its going to slip into afib.

I had an episode last night. I woke up because of some noise and when I tried sleeping again the strong palps kicked in. I rolled over, had a few random ones and slipped into afib. I took my metoprolol right away and rather than waiting the full 30 min I took my propafenone after 20 min. 15 minutes later i was in NSR which is weird because every other time I PIP it takes about 90 minutes.

I don't know what's going on but I don't like it. I need to find something to calm these PACs down. My attempts at taking more potasium and magnesium seemed to make it worse but stopping altogether led to my episode last night.

Very frustrating.

Monty

I had runs like yours for a long period of time. The prime suspect was too much sodium prior to the onset . So , I reduced sodium and increased potassium and magnesium and
after a few weeks they disappeared. My EP says these can arise once in awhile and he has no answer to why but what I was doing was ok.

For me diet is everything. That being said, I am taking the full gamut of supplements and feel my heart is stronger and more able to resist going into afib when I make a mistake in my diet. But for absolutly sure, the night time beast is the result of an upset stomach which is the result of what I put in it. It would be easy for me to say to do this or do that, as it worked for me, but I think we each need to figure out what our systems are reacting to. If you read this web site carefully you will find many many references to a Paleo diet, and numerous people who have tamed the beast on such a diet. Paleo is very restrictive and you end up cutting most things out of your diet, and as a result you eliminate those offending items without really knowing what they are. Instead of Paleo I went a different way and used some cutting edge and readily available testing and found that I am severely intolerant to gluten. I also found another very interesting list of foods which over the years I have become intolerant to. Basically my gut and in particular my small intestine, where the nutrients are absorbed, has become damaged and un-healthy. My doctor described the villi in my small intestine as being like a worn shag carpet where the individual hairs should be standing up and healthy and mine are laying down and flat.

Your small intestine is about 23 feet long and it is loaded with villi which in turn are covered with small hairs and are responsible for absorbing the nutrients from your food. The surface area of the villi and hair is the same as a baskeball court. A healthy small intestine is mandatory for a healthy body. When your small intestine is damaged, as yours probably is, we become unhealthy and get symptoms such as afib or rashes or other severe health issues.

Make no mistake about it, your body has become unhealthy. In a way we are lucky that symptom of our unhealthy body is afib and not a heart attack or cancer, but in any event we have been given a second chance to change things.

I believe my afib is the result of nutrient deficency (which has been proven through testing) which is the result of a long running intolerance to gluten (which has been proven through testing) which has also lead to a leaky gut and an auto immune response to a variety of other foods (which is my doctors opinion).

I suggest you look at getting an IgG food sensitivity test done as your first line of defense. You may be surprised at what you find. Your western MD doctor will likely not give you such a test and may even council you against them. But remember that your MD is basically an agent for the pharmaceutical business, and the multi gazillion dollar anti acid business would be wiped out if everyone had these tests.

So far I have almost totally eliminated the night time events. I figure that I lost over 500 nights of sleep in my first 4 years with this thing, so this change is remarkable. I feel that I have eliminated at least 75% of my afib, without having an ablation.

Just say no to the beast and get your life back.

Another member of the gluten/food intolerance group here. Corn, and eventually nightshades and legumes would also bring on afib. Unfortunately for me, it was so long before I learned all this (through trial and error mostly) that even after I eliminated them all I would still drop into afib when I went to bed. It took a long while to heal the leaky gut and stop reacting to additional foods. During this time I also developed other autoimmune diseases like Hashimoto's thyroiditis and psoriatic arthritis.

Potassium and magnesium helped quite a bit with the afib but it is hard for me since I have renal problems and take diuretics. So even though, like Ron, I had effected about a 75% improvement, I developed a new afib trigger which was raising my left arm above my head. Since I was fast approaching the CHADS age cut-off for me (another couple of years) I elected for the ablation anyway, and I have not had actual afib since the procedure in June according to the recordings I have made and sent to LifeWatch. It seems that the left arm raising events were arising from the LAA, which Dr. Natale also isolated.

New for me post-ablation are these hard ectopic beats sometimes when I first lie down in bed, and I am afraid of an afib attack which feels like it is trying to come on. But I can usually suppress them with breathing and they pass; it is really a compression kind of feeling. But on several occasions I have taken flec. and they have gone away. Since I am back in NZ I have not checked this out with Dr. Natale yet. However, I have noticed that if I neglect my second dose of Metagenics Fibroplex Plus magnesium I am more likely to get this, so have been more assiduous lately.

Montos, I had them for the first time a couple of months ago during the afternoon. I meditated for a while and they went away. But then when I stood up, I went straight into afib. And it was freaky enough afib that I went to the ER. 10 hours later, I was let out, having finally achieved NSR, although the weird beats (diagnosed for me as PACs) still come around from time to time. And sometimes lead to afib, but not always.
Nancy

Neroli B. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> New for me post-ablation are these hard ectopic
> beats sometimes when I first lie down in bed, and
> I am afraid of an afib attack which feels like it
> is trying to come on. But I can usually suppress
> them with breathing and they pass; it is really a
> compression kind of feeling. But on several
> occasions I have taken flec. and they have gone
> away. Since I am back in NZ I have not checked
> this out with Dr. Natale yet.

I have similar experience since ablation. No AF but some very clear missing heartbeats, sometimes running together. I think pre-ablation these might have brought on AF.. weird - no one seems to have an explanation as to why these seem to be replacing AF in some of us post-ablatees