Cholesterol conundrum

Since the start of this year, and discovering the forum (huge gratitude!), after the onset of LAF, I made equally huge changes to my lifestyle.

My diet changed - and I have adhered to this 90% of the time - to a lower fat (very low sat fat), low salt (inc. that essential good sodium/potassium ratio), well-balanced diet - plus I supplement with the usual things we discuss on here to mind those electrolytes. I pay attention to discussions. Lately I have removed white flour from my diet. I eat a lot of oats and fish (both most days).

I walk a lot (Edinburgh my home town seems all uphill!) although I don't go to the gym.

I feel good, have lost 40 lbs, and the afib is much better. And as we know, afib is connected to.... everything else so overall condition is important.

I had a blood test 9 months ago, and one again last week, the results of which I got today.

Oct 2010
Triglyceride : 2.41
HDL : 1.09
LDL : 3.5
Ratio : 5.2
Total Ch : 5.7

Aug 2011
Triglyceride : 1.35
HDL : 0.86
LDL : 4.00
Ratio : 6.4
Total Ch : 5.51

Needless to say, I was chuffed with the Triglyceride figure (that'll be the fish oil supplementation and diet I guess). BUT very disappointed with the other stats.

Why would my HDL go down and my LDL go up?

Many thanks indeed for any ideas! Much appreciated!!

Gary

Saturated animal fat is an essential nutrient; your nervous system is at least 40% sat fat.
If you don't eat enough of it your body will demand carbohydrates instead, with the result of insulin resistance and the HDL/LDL ratio you mention.

Advising a Scot to stop eating oats may seem odd, but you should read the posts of Fran Ross who had marvelous results by doing so.

William

Gary,

Here is the low carb point of view:

[high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com]

"HDL is a surrogate for saturated fat consumption. Elevating HDL with a drug will not give the benefits of saturated fat consumption. Triglycerides are a surrogate for sugar consumption. Dropping their level with a drug will not improve health, only putting the sugar in a bin will do that..."

Dean Ornish MD is known for a diet that has data showing reversal of heart disease. It is vegetarian, 10% fat calories (very low saturated), 20% protein and 70% carbs. One of the results people noticed on it was raised triglyerides, which he passed off as not a problem.

The general result on a low carb diet, with high saturated fat, is raised HDLs & lowered triglycerides. LDLs can increase, but normally the dense (bad) LDLs are replaced by the fluffy (good) LDLs, so not a bad profile.

In the current conference room, [www.afibbers.org] or [www.afibbers.org] (once the CR is archived), I detail the story of a female friend who has dropped 45 pounds from 170 to 125. She is an ovo-lacto vegetarian. Her diet was about 60 grams protein, a like amount of carbs and the rest (70%) fat. Most added fat was from coconut oil and ghee (clarified butter). She had a detailed blood test, including the VAP test for cholesterol and everything was perfect (though I don't have the numbers).

In the CR are many links for low carb references. In addition, this blog is a good one to root around in [high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com] . In the linked post, the blog author discusses an island where the estimated percentages of energy of the native diet are are 10%, 21% and 69% from protein, fat and carbohydrates. He also discusses their low HDLs and high TG's.

George

There are other factors than diet that can affect cholesterol levels. I get monthly blood readings regarding cholesterol and have found that stress and emotion are a significant factor in my case. For example, my total cholesterol was 40 points over acceptable (200 being acceptable) - following a series of family deaths. My doctor wanted me on drugs - I told her the total would return to normal when I stabilized emotionally- she disagreed. Three months later, with no dietary or exercise changes from usual, my cholesterol was normal again. This has occurred several times in my life, and I doubt that I am a special case.

I continue to take monthly readings as changes in diet can affect things in unexpected ways -

I second what Tom said re stress. Many years ago, when cholesterol was first being looked at, the Sunday Times Insight team did a very good study on the effect of diet changes on cholesterol levels. Diet reduced them slightly.

However driving round Hyde Park Corner (busiest intersection in London) at 5pm on Fridays sent cholesterol levels shooting sky high.

Gill

Gary, George et. al.

I have started to supplement at night with coconut oil, and it seems to have a vagolytic effect. Ir provides my system with enough energy to avoid those nighttime vagal moments. I can't take too much though or I have a tough time sleeping. I think that will change in time.

I had always been on a high carb, low fat diet, but that has all changed, and with the change I now have a lot more energy.

Steve

Steve,

I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that the coconut seems to reduce the vagal tone? Why would it do this?

Debbie

Hi Gary,

Do you know of Scottish (Aberdeen?) physician Malcolm Kendrick,MD? - and his book The Great Cholesterol Con? - see <[www.afibbers.org];. His brief educational video presentation is important information: [www.spacedoc.com].

Best to you!

Erling

Debbie,

This is only me thinking out loud, but it seems (operative word seems) that if I have a teaspoon of the coconut oil at night, it pushes my heart rate up from the high 40's to the mid-50's. I am going on a week now, so I don't want to say anything definitive but further reducing my carb intake, (no more apple before bed) and adding the coconut oil has had a positive effect to date.

Steve

Gary,

You may be interested in this article [www.yourhealthbase.com]

Hans

Hi Steve,

Would you (and anyone else) consider posting details of your low carb experiment in the current CR? <[www.afibbers.org];

My own experience is that coconut oil doesn't make a difference in my vagal tone, at least in the early morning when I measure. I commonly eat 2 - 3 tablespoons with dinner. I did check to see if it would raise my pulse by itself (as an allergy test), and it did not.

However, whatever works!

George

Hi George,

No trouble, happy to post--I wonder whether this effect will go away, because right now I find the coconut oil energizing. Those ketones seem to be kicking in, but I may have to up the dosage.

Steve

Gary, from all that I have read lately, it seems that your CRP levels might be even more telling. They measure the inflammation in your body, and if they are good, elevated cholesterol is not a big problem, unless it is extremely high - as in familial hypocholesteroma (sp?).

Have you had that tested too?

Lots of good info in both Dr. Atkins books on this, as well as a book called, "Overdosed America" by Dr. John Abramson. Read the section on Cholesterol....it has been quite overhyped.

Barb

Folks

Thank you so much for all your replies and info.

So much new information to take in - and some of it... I admit... reluctantly so.

I'm off to do more reading and learning!

Having thought things through a bit since the test results, I reckon I have over the past nine months eaten much more fruit (therefore fructose) so perhaps that is one cause. Still, I am intrigued as to how triglycerides can be halved (a good thing surely?) while the other lipids remain unchanged or are marginally 'worse'.

The saturated fat debate is difficult. I'm reading the newer Atkins diet book just now. But still, it seems counter-intuitive - despite what seem good results.

@William - after all we have been told, to discover oats might be 'bad' for us - I might just give up now!

@Erling - I hadn't heard of Dr Kendrick and will search that link now. Thanks.

@Barb H - thanks - not sure what CRP is, Barb?

@Tim & Gill - I didn't realise that about stress. It feels right, though. If a glass of wine or whisky de-stresses a bit - maybe that's not to be given up??

@Steve, I'll follow up your reports in the CR.

@Hans - thanks for the link, I'll be reading that this weekend, too!


Despite the frustrations of this subject, it does at least seem that the good nutritional advice in terms of the essential trio and K/Na balance is fundamentally right - and works.

Ah, this business of staying alive isn't simple.

Hans

Again, many thanks for that link - now that I've read it.

Absolutely fascinating.

Gary

Gary - to eat Paleo, you avoid grains. Oats included. Refer to the Gluten Sensitivity post which explains about oats and how the body reacts to gluten sensitivity with a long list of symptoms not often linked to gluten.

If your body is reacting to the gluten from oats contamination, it may reflect in some of your tests.

I agree with Barb, the CRP measurement tells much more than many other of the standard tests.

Jackie