Afib and scintillating scotoma

Just wondering if anyone on this board has experienced ocular migraine/scintillating scotoma and whether there may be a relationship between this and afib. In some studies that I've accidentally happened across, a relationship has been considered, but nothing definite. I have had ocular migraines since about age 30, so it's been about 45 years; they stopped when I was on a beta blocker but now that I am off the BB, they have returned.

Laura

Laura,

As with almost any dis-ease, magnesium has a big hand in migraine:

783,000 google results for 'migraine magnesium'
[www.google.com]

A random pick: [www.relieve-migraine-headache.com]

Erling

A-fib, migraine, magnesium, beta-blockers.

[www.rense.com] excerpt:

For example, magnesium was first shown to be of value in the treatment of cardiac arrhythmias in 1935. More than seventy years later, there are now numerous double-blind studies showing magnesium to be of benefit for many types of arrhythmias including atrial fibrillation, ventricular premature contractions, ventricular tachycardia, and severe ventricular arrhythmias.

Magnesium supplementation has also been shown to be helpful in angina due to either a spasm of the coronary artery or atherosclerosis. The beneficial effects of magnesium in angina relate to its ability improve energy production within the heart; dilate the coronary arteries resulting in improved delivery of oxygen to the heart; reduce peripheral vascular resistance resulting in reduced demand on the heart; inhibit platelets from aggregating and forming blood clots; and improve heart rate.

Magnesium supplementation is also critical in congestive heart failure (CHF). Studies have shown that CHF patients with normal levels of magnesium significantly live longer than those with lower magnesium levels. Many of the conventional drugs for CHF and high blood pressure (diuretics, beta-blockers, calcium channel-blockers, etc.) deplete body magnesium stores. Magnesium supplementation generally produces a modest impact in lowering high blood pressure (i.e., less than 10 mm Hg for both the systolic and diastoli

Laura:

I have never seen the word scotoma, I had to look it up, it does fit. I have been getting ocular migraines since my late teens, but usually I only would get 2 or 3 a year, the last 10 years I have been getting a lot more. It is strange I can go for months without any ocular migraines then I will get maybe 3 or 4 a month.

Certain supplements that have fermented soybeans will give me problems, like coq10, K2,3, nattokinase, fish oil. The consensus is to take magnesium, I have taken mag. for a number of years, I either can't retain enough mag. or it doesn't work.

There could be a realationship between ocular migraines and afib as there have been a few people on this board that have said they have both. I have both, my mother had the same. If I remember correctly I thought Hans had a survey on this topic, if he sees this, perhaps he will respond.

Many years ago I went to a head pain clinic, had many tests plus an MRI of my head (nothing there, hahaha), so since at that time I hadn't gotten a lot of ocular migraines and I really didn't get any bad headaches with the auras usually lasting only about a 1/2 hr., I would only wait them out and take an aspirin.

Funny, but I got an aura last night, I have noticed I have been getting quite a few lately, I have also been drinking a cup of "sleepytime tea" in the evening, it only has camomile and a couple other herbs that I didn't think would bother me, I guess this will be another no-no.

It sure is weird, I hope you get lots of response, I really hate these auras almost more than afib.

Liz

In addition to optimizing IC magnesium, in some cases migraines are mechanical (structural) in origin… manipulations at the axis level which involves the first cervical vertibra (C1) has been found to bring relief to certain types of migraines that may not be driven by mineral deficiency or hormonal imbalances. This is a chiropractic adjustment. It’s important to find one experienced in this adjustment.

Many times migraines are food-sensitivity related, especially gluten but frequently artificial sweeteners and hidden chemicals in packaged foods such as MSG and the hidden forms of MSG.

It’s also written that migraines can be the result of inadequate hydration. Be sure you are drinking plenty of pure water; not municipal tap water…. Numbers vary but don’t rely on ‘thirst’ to tell you that you are needing more water. Most people don’t hydrate well enough.

Going gluten-free is worth a try. Costs you nothing to try it.

Jackie

Erling and Jackie, thank you for the valuable information you always provide. I'm thinking that perhaps the ocular migraines of late are due to a combination of stress and dehydration. Here in Tucson it's easy to get dehydrated and I often find myself late in the afternoon realizing that I've not had any water since breakfast. Fortunately, I do not experience headache pain with these, as some do, nor is my vision interrupted enough to be disabling--just an irritation. So, dehydration can be a common denominator for afib and OMs. I'll sign off and go get a glass of water.

Laura

Hi Elizabeth,

So, you also experience OMs. Like you, I don't usually have a headache and on the few occasions I do, it's very mild. Mine last for approximately 15-20 minutes and I have never had to stop doing whatever I was doing because of them--only a small area of my vision is affected. My mother had migraines but she kept her health issues very much to herself so I don't know whether she may have had AF. My younger daughter has migraines which are severe and disabling for her. I think for me, dehydration could be a big factor and I'm going to be more diligent about drinking water throughout the day. Best wishes to you.

Laura

[www.newmediaexplorer.org]
This is an amazing website. Here are just a few excerpts from the page Making the Magnesium-Migraine Link:

....It's very likely that magnesium deficiency is a widespread cause of migraines, maintains Dr. Herbert Mansmann [professor of medicine]. Studies show that many people don't even come close to getting the Daily Value of magnesium, which is 400 milligrams. "On a daily basis, 30 to 40 percent of American people take less than 75 percent of the Daily Value of magnesium," says Dr. Mansmann ...

....What's more, several different things, from the caffeine in just two cups of coffee a day to the chemicals in most asthma medications, remove some magnesium from your system. "We know that intake is low for a lot of people. We know that a lot of medications, such as diuretics (water pills) and a variety of cardiovascular medications, can increase magnesium losses. We know that people with diabetes who have high blood sugar lose a lot more magnesium in the urine and, as a result, run the risk of magnesium deficiency," says Karen Kubena, Ph.D., associate professor of nutrition at Texas A & M University in College Station. Even stress, a frequent cause of migraines, can remove magnesium from your system, says Dr. Mansmann....

....According to his records, Dr. Burton Altura (professor of medicine) says that about 50 to 60 percent of his migraine patients have low magnesium levels. But once they begin treatment, he says, they often experience immediate relief. "We can say that 85 to 90 percent of these patients are successfully treated, and that's pretty miraculous," says Dr. Altura...

Erling, I'm forwarding all those nice links you provided to my daughter. It's worth giving magnesium a try if she can get off the nasty medication she's on.
Thanks so much.

Laura

Liz,

Indeed, you are correct. LAF Survey 6 asked about migraine headaches. Here is the conclusion:

"Migraines
Fourteen of 65 respondents had experienced a migraine headache in the past and eight were still experiencing them (1-3 in 6-month period). Thus the current prevalence of migraines among the 65 respondents is 12.3%, not significantly different from the 10.3% experienced among the general US population. There was no correlation between the number of migraine attacks and the frequency or duration of afib episodes. Only one out of 11 had ever noticed an association between migraines and afib episodes. There was no indication that afib type (adrenergic, mixed, vagal, permanent) was related to the prevalence of migraines. Thus it is unlikely that there is an association between migraine headaches and LAF."

Also, besides magnesium the following supplements have also been found useful in preventing migraines;

[www.yourhealthbase.com]

Hans

The problem with the survey is that many people will not realise that the visual disturbance they get is in fact a migraine.

I used to get "electric" ziggy zaggy areas crossing my vision every few months. I ignored these. I had an ablation in May and had a bout of these shortly after. I researched them and found they were in fact ocular migraines and were quite common after ablations as a side effect of the drugs used. I was very surprised as I always associated migraines with headaches, which I never got with the ocular migraine.

Now fortunately that my rhythm seems OK I don't get them anymore.

Mark

Yes!

Mark, I had a flurry of these after my ablation as well. They seem to have resolved gradually becoming less symptomatic and shorter in duration.

Thanks to everyone for your input on this issue.