new to AF forum.

New to the forum. I just got diagnosed with AF during an EKG. This was 3 weeks ago. I am in constant AF with zero symptoms. I want to monitor my EKG with an app. Any suggestions? I do not want to get a smartphone. Also, any opinions about taking magnesium glycinated 400 mg/day? Thank you.;-

I purchased a couple of devices from EMAY: the EMG-20 and EMG-6L. These are standalone devices that do not require interfacing with a smartphone to operate. If you want to save the EKG data, they connect directly to a computer using a USB cable. I've been happy with both of them.

Not sure about the 400 gm of bis-glycinate, but your kidneys should excrete what you don't need, all things being equal. If they're healthy. If you have been taking it for more than a week and you're still in AF, it's not the Mg. Could be potassium, but.....who knows.

Many rely on a Kardia Mobile if they don't want a smart watch or a ring or wires hanging off them. It's not much money, very handy, and very reliably accurate for most layman's purposes. You can download an ECG and sent it in digital form to an electrophysiologist or a cardiologist.

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gloaming
Many rely on a Kardia Mobile if they don't want a smart watch or a ring or wires hanging off them. It's not much money, very handy, and very reliably accurate for most layman's purposes. You can download an ECG and sent it in digital form to an electrophysiologist or a cardiologist.

However Kardia does require a phone & app.

There is the Wellue 24-hour monitor. You wear it either via stick-on electrodes or a chest strap, and it will record up to 24 hours. You download the data to a computer via a usb connector. You get ecg tracings and can upload the data to a website for AI analysis. The AI analysis will tell you % of time in afib, number of PACs, PVCs, and much more. It’s not perfect in its interpretation (you can get false positives for afib occasionally), but I’ve found it to be very useful. It’s particularly good if your arrythmias are brief, and there’s no time to pull out the Kardia Mobile. The Wellue monitor was around $230 last time I got one.

Yup, it do...as do the rings, I believe. I accept that the OP doesn't want a smartphone, but....it's some kind of wearable no matter what, plus all the accoutrements, wires, etc. All that's left that I know of is a daily visit to an ECG specialist or buy one for oneself.

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GeorgeN

However Kardia does require a phone & app.

To download an ecg to personal storage, it looks like a subscription is now required. In Dec/2024 I was able to download many ecg's and email them to an EP but I tried downloading today and it did not work. Unless someone like me who doesn't have a subscription can say otherwise.

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TomR
To download an ecg to personal storage, it looks like a subscription is now required. In Dec/2024 I was able to download many ecg's and email them to an EP but I tried downloading today and it did not work. Unless someone like me who doesn't have a subscription can say otherwise.

Their website still indicates a non-subscriber should be able to do this, but may just not have been updated.
Curious if your app still has a history selection someplace in the menu?

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GeorgeN

To download an ecg to personal storage, it looks like a subscription is now required. In Dec/2024 I was able to download many ecg's and email them to an EP but I tried downloading today and it did not work. Unless someone like me who doesn't have a subscription can say otherwise.

Their website still indicates a non-subscriber should be able to do this, but may just not have been updated.
Curious if your app still has a history selection someplace in the menu?

Thx for your comment, yes, the kardia app shows the history tab and the ecg files which were made 6 wks ago are visible and can be opened, but when going to download, the folder can be selected and after clicking 'done', the file is not in the said folder. Only one folder by that name, so it appears that Alivecor have prevented local or cloud saving.

Hi like you I started with asymptomatic AF but mine continued for nearly 2 years making it classified as persistent. I ignored the periodic episodes that occurred when my Apple watch signaled that I had it. I am a physician, and some physicians are notorious about ignoring or denying their medical problems as I did. I had the full cardiac workup and was started on Eliquis because of my age and other criteria. Having persistent AF is not a good class because it is less responsive to therapies. A Holter monitor (tapes your heart rhythm for 24/7 for a week or more) indicated I was in AF 39% of the time. Moreover, my family history indicated a strong genetic predilection for AF, heart blocks that made me even more concerned. I was a ticking time bomb.

By chance I started on a laxative, and I was self-monitoring my AF on my Apple watch (3 to 4 times a day only 30 seconds for total of 2 minutes a day) and over a few months, I would witness occasional sinus rhythm (SR).The laxative had magnesium(Mg) hydroxide in it and having a background in biochemistry I recalled the importance of Mg as a co-factor for ATPase function, an energy producing enzyme that is located in all our cells, including heart cells. I considered something positive was happening because of the Mg. The laxative was too strong, so I switched to Mg glycinate and noticed more and more SR. I decided to switch to another Mg supplement, Mg gluconate and SR continued to be more frequent, and around 20 weeks from the start of the Mg supplements I noticed I was in SR. I read incessantly about AF, Mg, potassium, hydration and created a protocol that except for a few breakthroughs I have been in SR 99% of the time based on the last calendar year documented on my iPhone/Apple watch and by the Kardia App.

There is science that has been underappreciated about Mg and AF.
1. A normal Mg blood test does not exclude Mg deficiency because the blood compartment represents only 1% of the human body Mg stores;
2. The half-life of Mg is 6 weeks for someone in Mg balance so if one eliminated Mg completely in 6 weeks the body stores would be reduced 50%;
3. There are studies indicating that if one has AF, there is likely pre-existing Mg deficiency in heart cells even with a normal Mg blood test;
4. Knowing that, it is logical to conclude it may take several 6-week half-lives to replenish Mg in heart cells of AF individuals, which for me supported why it took 20 weeks before my AF converted to SR;
5. I had two episodes of brief AF in the past 18 months, both associated with dehydration, one with bronchitis and fever, and another because i
was in a heated amphitheater and forgot to continue hydrating myself. One article indicated 10% of AF individuals have preexisting
dehydration so a fever would worsen the dehydration. When I drank fluids, AF reversed back to SR
6. I needed a potassium (K) supplement because I was on a diuretic. Not everyone needs it and one must have normal kidney function to be on
a K supplement.
7. As an aside numerous community studies of thousands of healthy participants with no history of heart conditions or AF for as long as 20 years, some for 2 years concluded there was a strong correlation between a high incidence of AF with low blood Mg levels and/or K blood levels;
8. I started to eat foods fortified with Mg and K because my calculations of the amount of elemental Mg I was absorbing with Mg supplements
was not adequate to achieve 420 mg of recommended daily allowance (RDA) of elemental Mg.
9, I continued to monitor my EKGs daily (3-4 X daily )remaining alert for a recurrence of AF.
10. I may be a unicorn and cardiologists who have heard my story are in consternation because all AF guidelines never include oral Mg as a potential converter with Mg , K ,hydration,& self monitoring my EKGs.
11. I did extensive research on Mg supplements, and discovered because there is no FDA regulations, the claims are not based on data.I landed on one that has published data indicating fast action, excellent absorption and can maintain stable blood levels of Mg It has data from a clinical study suggesting it could work as fast as intravenous Mg. I decided not to mention it online because it alone will not likely accomplish the end result I have without incorporating all the components I mentioned in my protocol. Importantly, I believe whatever one does in this arena with supplements one has to include their health care professional before starting it as they will be familiar with your medical conditions.

I have submitted my story to several prestigious medical journals, and they have been rejected because they were considered anecdotal despite the fact all my data was accumulated with meticulous effort and some on my iPhone without my awareness. A statistician confirmed my data as being highly significant. I know my story needs to be tested with double blind protocols having supervised hundreds of pharmaceutical studies with that approach. My frustration is I can't get the medical journals to print my story to even encourage double blind studies. Consequently, I felt compelled to write my story in a book but I believe the rules of the forum are against mentioning the title because it would be considered self-promoting. That is my story for whatever its worth and if anyone decides to do what I did, they must involve their health care professional.
I empathize with members who have had terrible outcomes.

Hi Hugger, welcome to the forum. Rather an unusual way to introduce yourself but that's okay.

Regarding your inability to get published, I'm sure you recognize that a study where N=1 and N=the author is always going to be considered anecdotal. Perhaps try publishing it as a case history?

I tried but I had to describe myself . In any event I believe in science so to paraphrase the title in an editorial in a cardiac .journal titled’ Magnesium for Atrial Fibrillation : Magic or Myth?’ mine is neither, it is reality and being a physician scientist I’m frustrated because unless I am a unicorn ,I have discovered a potential low risk intervention for at least my type of AF.
Another part I didn’t discuss has to do with % Heart rate Variability ( HRV) which is time between successive heart beats recorded without my awareness on my iPhone. When the interval in msec is large like as high as 140 msec, I have AF. In contrast when the interval is short between heart beats it ranges around 14 msec and I don’t have AF. I can use the HRV as a canary to tell me I am having asymptomatic AF. I have not seen that reported in medical articles. . I may be the present day Galelio who was scorned upon ifor his heretic idea that the earth revolves around the sun. Not sure how to get the medical community to open their eyes to a new possibility that might make a difference for some with my type of AF. Think out even further: could my protocol become useful to prevent post interventional AF like after cardiac ablation or after elective heart surgery? I’m not suggesting it could work but theoretically it might because based on science Mg may compete with a cytokine( a protein mediator of inflammation called IL-1beta) expressed during inflammation that can inhibit ATPase energy releasing enzymes. I believe that is why pacemakers fail unless Mg is replenished.
All of this in my book. I’m not in the business of selling books, just knowledge about underappreciated observations that made a difference for me. There is no profit selling a book as I didn’t plan on spending over 2 years working and researching and Mg . The irony is being scientific I scoffed at supplements but now I believe there is merit in scientifically supported Mg .

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Hugging
There is science that has been underappreciated about Mg and AF.
1. A normal Mg blood test does not exclude Mg deficiency because the blood compartment represents only 1% of the human body Mg stores;
2. The half-life of Mg is 6 weeks for someone in Mg balance so if one eliminated Mg completely in 6 weeks the body stores would be reduced 50%;
3. There are studies indicating that if one has AF, there is likely pre-existing Mg deficiency in heart cells even with a normal Mg blood test;
4. Knowing that, it is logical to conclude it may take several 6-week half-lives to replenish Mg in heart cells of AF individuals, which for me supported why it took 20 weeks before my AF converted to SR;
5. I had two episodes of brief AF in the past 18 months, both associated with dehydration, one with bronchitis and fever, and another because i
was in a heated amphitheater and forgot to continue hydrating myself. One article indicated 10% of AF individuals have preexisting
dehydration so a fever would worsen the dehydration. When I drank fluids, AF reversed back to SR
6. I needed a potassium (K) supplement because I was on a diuretic. Not everyone needs it and one must have normal kidney function to be on
a K supplement.
7. As an aside numerous community studies of thousands of healthy participants with no history of heart conditions or AF for as long as 20 years, some for 2 years concluded there was a strong correlation between a high incidence of AF with low blood Mg levels and/or K blood levels;
8. I started to eat foods fortified with Mg and K because my calculations of the amount of elemental Mg I was absorbing with Mg supplements
was not adequate to achieve 420 mg of recommended daily allowance (RDA) of elemental Mg.
9, I continued to monitor my EKGs daily (3-4 X daily )remaining alert for a recurrence of AF.
10. I may be a unicorn and cardiologists who have heard my story are in consternation because all AF guidelines never include oral Mg as a potential converter with Mg , K ,hydration,& self monitoring my EKGs.
11. I did extensive research on Mg supplements, and discovered because there is no FDA regulations, the claims are not based on data.I landed on one that has published data indicating fast action, excellent absorption and can maintain stable blood levels of Mg It has data from a clinical study suggesting it could work as fast as intravenous Mg. I decided not to mention it online because it alone will not likely accomplish the end result I have without incorporating all the components I mentioned in my protocol. Importantly, I believe whatever one does in this arena with supplements one has to include their health care professional before starting it as they will be familiar with your medical conditions.

Your story is very interesting and your success very encouraging. Thank you for freely sharing it.

For anyone interested I don’t believe I can mention the name of my book on AF but if you are interested reading about my success and being a resource on AF and Mg , my book on AF has a cover with a physician holding binoculars.

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Hugging
For anyone interested I don’t believe I can mention the name of my book on AF but if you are interested reading about my success and being a resource on AF and Mg , my book on AF has a cover with a physician holding binoculars.

You're free to mention the name of your book in the course of a discussion where it's relevant. Just don't make it repetitive. The restriction is on outright advertising, which would preclude things like links to places to buy the book. If someone is interested, the title and author should be sufficient for them to find it.

My story has been posted here many times. In brief, I got my first afib episode around the 1st week of July 2004 (age 49) a day or two after a training run on a 14,000' mountain. I later determined it was a delayed vagal trigger. I had a habit of taking my aural blood pressure periodically. I did that morning and my pulse sounded unusual. Threw on a Polar HR monitor and noticed my pulse was at 145 just walking up the stairs from the basement. Went to the ER. They did not print an ECG but visually thought it was flutter or afib, a longer duration monitor later confirmed afib. My serum K was around 2.8 mg/dL. Episodes came 10-14 days around 3AM and lasted 6-9 hours. I found I could convert many with exercise. Then about two months in, I had an episode that didn't convert. I did an EXATEST for intracellular electrolytes and my Mg++ was low. Two or so months in to that episode the EP wanted me to stay out of rhythm after a Holter test result (afib resting heart rate < 100 BPM).

I proposed a "Plan B" to him. I'd already determined that my path to afib was chronic fitness, so I proposed modifying training (later figured out that limiting longer duration endurance activity to a "Zone 2" or nasal breathing effort limit eliminated an exercise trigger - though short duration HIIT is fine), as well as supplementing with electrolytes, including magnesium & potassium ( amounts TBD). I requested a PRN script for flecainide to be used for conversion to NSR based on this paper. Lastly I requested cardioversion for the episode. He consented and suggested I consume B6 along with the magnesium. To his surprise, a loading dose of flec converted the then 2.5 month episode in 20 hours. I've basically been following this for 20+ years. I did learn that adding 2 - 4g of taurine powder/day was beneficial. Around year 8, I determined that excess calcium consumption was detrimental. It "lowered the bar" for afib triggers as well as for "no trigger" afib.

I would record RR heartbeat overnight with a Polar strap/watch and download the data for analysis (later using an app built for research rather than a watch - a UK optometrist sent me a bunch of annotated heart rate vs time graphs maybe 18 years ago [www.afibbers.org] ). I would use PAC & PVC counts/hour as a metric for whether what I was doing was better or worse. After about 5 months of tweaking and 3 afib episodes, I had two years of zero afib. I thought I was cured! So I quit all supplementation. As to the 6-week half life of magnesium, it took 24 or 48 hours of no supps for my first episode in two years. This banished the "cure" thought & I went back as before.

For most of these years, my AF burden has been < 0.05% (with a few hiccups). In my case, my magnesium dose was to bowel tolerance, which can be north of 4 g elemental Mg++/day for me. I consume my potassium as 2 tsp of potassium citrate (about 4 g of K) powder in a liter of water which I consume over the day (my version of timed release). For me, any form of magnesium works & I've tried all many have heard of and some they may not have, as long as it is sufficient quantity. I have 20 kg bags of magnesium chloride (nigari- the Japanese use it to coagulate tofu) in my garage.

Steve Carr is another guy with a research bent who has a great afib remission story. However, magnesium does not work for him. See his post here.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2025 10:30PM by GeorgeN.

Gerge N

Thak you for your quick response. Apparently, you are noticing benefits with Mg and K but it took only 1-2 days off of Mg to resume AF. I believe that is possible because if you do convert to SR, AF is lurking ready to take over because of the energy concepts I described. Even though it took me 6 weeks to get to SR, there was one day when I reduced my daily dose and the next day AF returned. Maintaining my Mg dose has kept me almost entirely in SR.

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Hugging

Another part I didn’t discuss has to do with % Heart rate Variability ( HRV) which is time between successive heart beats recorded without my awareness on my iPhone. When the interval in msec is large like as high as 140 msec, I have AF. In contrast when the interval is short between heart beats it ranges around 14 msec and I don’t have AF. I can use the HRV as a canary to tell me I am having asymptomatic AF. I have not seen that reported in medical articles. ..

I've been monitoring my HRV like a hawk these past couple of months since I discovered its capabilities on my iPhone. I think I almost drive myself crazy watching it whether daily or hourly or sometimes multiple times within an hour. I've gotten a pretty good feel of knowing it will be nice and steady based on the number before I click on Beat To Beat Measurements.

That said, I woke up this a.m. with high heart rate. Apparently it was high for at least 10 minutes before I awakened and according to FitBit is was in DEEP sleep stage and even had my mouthpiece for Sleep Apnea in from a dentist that specializes in this area. Took about 2 hours to convert. Drank a Biolyte (electrolyte drink) and about 30 minutes later converted. Not sure. Been exercising, not vigorously 2x's per day from Sedentary and doing great this week and had increased water intake as hydration is always a battle for me especially in the winter, so don't know IF I had depleted too many electrolytes with increased water and thus increased urination, sometimes hourly even during the night or what. Also stressed with semi-annual doc appt this afternoon. Anyways drank the Biolyte AND let out a burp of excess air and within 1 minute went back to NSR. Electrolytes helped? Relieved pressure on Vagus Nerve from the burp of air? Afib is so darn frustrating especially when you are sound asleep and wake up with it which seems to be 100% of the time with me although perhaps some daytime varied rates but nothing high just fluctuating beat-to-beat measurements.

But yep HRV, watching it very closely.

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GeorgeN
Their website still indicates a non-subscriber should be able to do this, but may just not have been updated.
Curious if your app still has a history selection someplace in the menu?

CORRECTION
Re the ability of not being able to save an ecg, i just found that eReader Prestigio would open and save an ecg and Whatsapp allows sending it. Samsung Notes would not.

Hi I have a fear of death because of my inappropriate sinus tachycardia

My echocardiogram is normal with normal LF and ejection fraction

Do you worry about your afib?

Is jogging healthy and do you excersise

Hi AL 1983
Magnesium can slow heart rate. in part that is why it can be effective controlling rapid AF. I do not know if it would control your problem but given that it has minimal risk you might discuss it with your primary physician. My protocol details magnesium in great detail iin my book which is available online.under Atrial Fibrillation with a cover of a doctor holding binoculars.
Best
Hugging