Help with ectopics

Well good news and bad news. Good news is my AFIB seems to be under control since I’ve cut back on exercise, closing in on six months AFIB free. Up until Sunday I would have at most one to two skipped beats a day at most. I am calling them skipped beats since if I am taking my pulse I feel the absence of a beat and the next beat is a little strong.

On Sunday for about an hour I was getting approximately one skipped beat out of every ten good ones, very uncomfortable. On Monday they got worse and lasted about five hours. On Tuesday I did not have any. And today they lasted about six hours again. This is all new to me and I am asking for any kind of help. They are not as uncomfortable as AFIB, but my AFIB’s usually last less than 20 minutes. These runs of ectopics are lasting hours.

I haven’t changed my diet and not on any medication other than 400Mg Magnesium glycinate. The only thing I can think of is that I am under more stress than usual. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I have an old bottle of Metroprolol that I haven’t used, could I try this as a last resort?
Also, when would I consider calling my Cardiologist?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2020 05:07PM by MikeN.

Here are a couple of topical articles [theskepticalcardiologist.com]

[theskepticalcardiologist.com]

He talks about > 10,000 PVC's/day (yours sound like PVC's) as the point to start paying attention. If your heart rate is 60 BPM, that would be 86,400 beats/day and 10% would be 8,640.

My first wife started getting PVC's years ago (non afibber). She responded to more magnesium and potassium. For potassium, I suggest people put 2 tsp (4 grams potassium) potassium citrate powder in a liter of water and consume over the day, for timed release.

I'm 3.5 months post ablation getting thousands ectopics daily prior to ablation maybe 1 every couple weeks. Went back on metopropol 50mg. Metopropol taken ectopics from thousands to less then 200 daily. Hoping they'll calm down on there own. Hard not to feel like I traded one problem for another, guess bright side is I'm told this problem is harmless😬

The mystery with ectopics is the same as with AFib.
They're well known for (hundreds of) years.
How they're acting in the heart is well known too.
Cases in which it's really worth treating them are described.

Why they appear and disappear is still a mystery. There are comorbidities or ways of life increasing the risks of having HR disorders, but with no certainty. It's individual.

There are treatments that work... for some people ; but they can have no effect for others and, in the worst case, only unwanted effects.

All suggestions are welcome, as they are for me (I've to deal with ectopics an AFib for years), but we have to make our own religion about them.

There is one thing I'm sure about, regarding ectopics : the more you're worrying about them, the more they'll affect your everyday life. Being "tuned" to our heart rhythm every minute of the day and the night is often what we're doing, and it's bad. It generates stress, and stress generates ectopics. A vicious cycle.

What we're often doing while we "listen" to our HR or while checking our pulse is breathing a bad way. Breathing is something we shouldn't have to worry about. It's natural. Think about your breathing, and I'm sure you'll breathe differently, maybe irregularly. And irregular breathing may affect the regularity of your HR.

Been dealing with ectopics and afib for >15 years...per Pompon they randomly come and go. Some triggers are sure to bring them on...other times I am well rested, seemingly stress free and following a strict diet and wham, they show up...

For me...
Eat a diet of minimal fats, no dairy, no processed foods, no red meats. Take 50 mg of Atenelol 1/day...statin and baby aspirin due to high CAC count...but thats a different tale. 1 banana/day and either a Naked Juice, Glass of Orange Juice or Low Sodium V8...also lots of vegetables...when I do this, the ectopics go away...and largely stay away...Mg and K loading via my diet versus the supplement. This has worked for me for years...

Also please note when I reduced the fat intake, chronic heartburn issues disappeared after 20 years of eating rolaids for breakfast.

There was a time when I had PVC's all day every day for weeks at a time...holter monitors, unable to sleep...was a Friday in my office and I decided to hit the happy hour...several drinks later, the ectopics stopped...and stayed away. Not sure if this was because I quit worrying about them or some other chemical reaction but to Pompons last two paragraphs, our ability to mentally deal with these rate issues are at least as important as our physical ability.

There are many very well informed posters here who graciously share their experiences and lessons learned. Read up, educate yourself and reach out to some of the folks here...you will undoubtedly find a path that works for you....good luck!

Do you still take the BB for the ectopics?

Quote
sh weca67
Been dealing with ectopics and afib for >15 years...per Pompon they randomly come and go. Some triggers are sure to bring them on...other times I am well rested, seemingly stress free and following a strict diet and wham, they show up...

For me...
Eat a diet of minimal fats, no dairy, no processed foods, no red meats. Take 50 mg of Atenelol 1/day...statin and baby aspirin due to high CAC count...but thats a different tale. 1 banana/day and either a Naked Juice, Glass of Orange Juice or Low Sodium V8...also lots of vegetables...when I do this, the ectopics go away...and largely stay away...Mg and K loading via my diet versus the supplement. This has worked for me for years...

Also please note when I reduced the fat intake, chronic heartburn issues disappeared after 20 years of eating rolaids for breakfast.

There was a time when I had PVC's all day every day for weeks at a time...holter monitors, unable to sleep...was a Friday in my office and I decided to hit the happy hour...several drinks later, the ectopics stopped...and stayed away. Not sure if this was because I quit worrying about them or some other chemical reaction but to Pompons last two paragraphs, our ability to mentally deal with these rate issues are at least as important as our physical ability.

There are many very well informed posters here who graciously share their experiences and lessons learned. Read up, educate yourself and reach out to some of the folks here...you will undoubtedly find a path that works for you....good luck!

Shca67 -

What is your CAC ?

Did you also take PPIs with exo-calcium?

Do you still eat any grains or seeds of grass? wheat, rice, etc ?

Tested fasting insulin?

Assuming born in 67 - you still have time to regress your CAC. I have been doing it for more than a year and have a 19% annual rate reduction. I know several people that achieve up to 50% annual reduction.

NLAMA- without any disrespect or criticism (mother hen), have you considered changing your diet of red meat (even if it’s lean) and bacon and perhaps lower your cholesterol to repair your CAC scores? I’m asking because I have micro vascular disease (small vessel disease), common for women and I see a cardiologist specialist/cardiac dietitian as well, who guides me on diet changes. No egg yolks, no coconut oil, no red meats, fat free dairy (easy since I am dairy free), no chicken skins when cooking chicken breast or turkey breast. No dark poultry meats, change your cooking oils -avoid canola and especially palm oils. I eat plenty of avocados for magnesium, olive oil and eat unsweetened almond yogurts and almond milk. and eat plenty of wild fatty salmon instead. Just mentioning it.

Most has been easy to adapt. I only served my family 40+ years ago onward fat free dairy, egg whites and skinless chicken. Unprocessed hot dogs on occasion and no sweets except for birthdays. Nonfat frozen yogurt as rewards. Decades ago my child came home from a sleepover and was so excited and had to tell me the most amazing story of eating yellow eggs...since my kid was raised in white scramble eggs and though eggs were white.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2020 10:59PM by susan.d.

Quote
susan.d
without any disrespect or criticism (mother hen), have you considered changing your diet of red meat (even if it’s lean) and bacon and perhaps lower your cholesterol to repair your CAC scores? I’m asking because I have micro vascular disease (small vessel disease), common for women and I see a cardiologist specialist/cardiac dietitian as well, who guides me on diet change

From what NLAMA has said about his CAC scores, I'd say he is doing very well. If you look at Raggi 2004, specifically figures 2 & 3, you'll note that someone who's annual volume score increase on serial CAC scores is 15% or less has nearly the same risk as someone with a zero score. NLAMA has said he's at 19% annual regression. These are spectacular results and many with high CAC scores would be very envious!!!

The best way to encourage microvascular circulation is with high levels of VEGF (vascular endothelial growth factor). Heavy resistance training will encourage secretion of this when we are young. As we age, the way to do it is with KAATSU or Blood Flow Resistance training. Pneumatic bands around the upper limb extremities will allow people to work out with light (25-35% of one repetition max) weights with the muscles in a mildly hypoxic environment. The pressures are set to restrict venous return, but allow arterial flow. There are tons of papers on this. The KAATSU devices will cycle the pressures, on for 30 seconds, off for 5. There is even benefit to just doing the pressure cycling with little exercise. I do both and usually have the bands cycling for at least hour every evening as I read or type. I do full workouts to failure on different muscle sets every morning.

Good advice George but I’m decked out from just dragging a hose around my backyard to water today when it was 63 degrees out. I feel spent like I did after two chemos back to back. I wish I could exercise and I wish I knew of your advice ten years ago...even five. This ablation is sure different from the index.

Maybe with my LAA isolation there was a loss of LAA contractility that had some adverse effects on LA emptying and volume? Would that make me feel so worn out from watering? A month post Index I was constructing a 6000 pound dry creek and felt great. It’s been 4 weeks post ablation this time and I can’t do swat.