Quotecolindo Who thought that lot up? It's got to have more to do with blood quality I would have thought. eg. if your blood is thick and sticky it would more likely clot. If you are talking about the math, that is how these statistics work. If you are talking about the 3.5%/year for a CHA2DS2-VASc score of "3" then this paper goes into how they figured the risk. With CHby GeorgeN - AFIBBERS FORUM
Thanks George, Who thought that lot up? It's got to have more to do with blood quality I would have thought. eg. if your blood is thick and sticky it would more likely clot.by colindo - AFIBBERS FORUM
Susan - My personal experience indicates the blanking period duration is most likely quite individualized. I’ve had 3 ablations…one for Afib, one for A-flutter that isolated the LAA followed by a touchup procedure. I had an experience with clot formation shortly after the blanking period (my first ablation - 2003) which could have been a disaster had I not resumed using the fibrinolytiby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Obviously, it’s reasonable (and smart) for afibbers to be concerned about the risk of stroke because of so many potential, influencing factors. If you’ve been reading here for years, then you know my concerns and the story about my clot issue. And for newer members, I want to remind that there are numerous underlying factors that contribute to what makes blood more likely to clot especially wby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Important to keep in mind the association between blood viscosity and clearance velocity. Long ago, there were numerous post on what that means. We were talking back then about the benefits of using the enzyme Nattokinase to help keep blood from adverse clotting - especially during AF event. The studies then were on Hemorheology and references were made to the studies being done at thatby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Colin - To add support to the merits of using the enzyme, nattokinase, I’ll offer this brief history on my clot experience. You probably recall my story of long ago (2004) when I reported that after my first ablation (2003) and when I went back for the requisite 3-mo. assessment which included a spiral CT scan of the heart, and I was cleared then to go off warfarin. I immediately resumed mby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
anneh - Here are links to past posts on nattokinase so you know about the reliable form, NSK-SD. Nattokinase would be my choice for when you stop using an Rx anticoag because the NK is well-known to help prevent the clot formation. (unless you are soy sensitive)...then you can consider Lumbrokinase which is also highly effective. It's also important to routinely do the labs that helby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Madeline – I have no argument with you about the many benefits of the supplements you take and the reasons why. However, when you start a new medication (especially, a blood thinner), for safety and to give the new med the opportunity to function as intended, you must eliminate any potential interferences or complications from nutritional supplements. It’s better to err on the side of cautiby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hello, MadMax and Welcome. What are the supplements in your routine along with dosages? Are you including any that help reduce the inflammatory factors that contribute to hyperviscosity (or thick, sticky blood)? How long have you been doing the supplementing and what other steps have you taken (lifestyle habits) to improve overall health...such as lose weight, limit alcohol, avoid foodby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
GaryPNW - On the risk of blood clots and controlled Afib..... There are several factors that help contribute to elevated blood viscosity aka hyperviscosity and there are corresponding lab tests that can help one monitor the status of what makes blood hyperviscous also called: thick, sticky blood. When I began my AF journey, the only anticoagulant available was warfarin/Coumadin. I triby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Joe - the hyper is correct... meaning viscosity too high which according to the hemorheology studies involves the shear stress/friction factors that relates to flow rate and also arterial damage in addition to the elevated tendency for clot formation..... thus, the terms: thick, sticky blood and risk of clot formation regarding stroke or MI risk. Jackieby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Happy New Year, Liz ! Yes.. B12 and other nutrients help reduce or control the "silent inflammation" factor that is foundational in what contributes to stroke risk... And just as pointed out in the recent Mitochondrial report, the oxidative damage is also a very important factor. For that reason, those previous posts on Silent Inflammation and Stroke Risk and the Clot Risk emphaby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Thanks, Liz, George and Joe. Liz... the quote you mentioned was from Dr. Vasquez's observations.... not my personal view or statement.... as are the other observations regarding the need for optimizing antioxidants to suppress the oxidative stress damage. I have just re-quoted some of the relevant points concerned why the oxidative stress damage is relevant for maintaining healthyby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hi Ken - it may not be an issue when one is on Eliquis, but the many factors that help cause elevated blood viscosity aka hyperviscosity are known to be influences for clot formation and the duration or frequency of AF events can definitely be an influence. So knowing all those factors makes sense for overall health regardless of whether or not you are an afibber. From a recent postby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Several factors to consider... when in arrhythmia, blood can pool or stagnate in some areas esp. in the heart chambers. That's where the anticoagulants help to keep afibbers stroke free. Prolonged afib increases the clotting tendency - thus reason for prescribing the OACs. However, there are also other factors that need to be recognized as contributors even if on an anticoagulant.by Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Mike - keep in mind for the short duration AF risk, this directly speaks to the hyperviscosity issue... and the tendency for "thick, sticky blood" to clot quickly. As the old adage quoted in the hemorheology literature.... "churn cream, you get butter, churn blood, you get a clot." So, going back to those tests that identify the risks for hyperviscosity including inflammatby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Just a comment on the overall risk of stroke... which has to do with blood's hypercoagulability property... a topic that has been discussed in various previous posts explaining the science of Hemorheology and the sheer-stress factor that influences clotting tendencies. This equates to thick, sticky blood which then has the tendency to form clots more easily... whether or not you experienceby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
QuoteJackie Hello Lindy and welcome. On the clot risk topic... there are several posts on effective, natural blood thinners.... most recently, the one on Lumbrokinase... a fibrinolytic enzyme that isn't soy-based. Here's the link and at the end, there are other links to previous reports on natural thinners... and also important, the testing that can be done to document yoby Lindy - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hello Lindy and welcome. On the clot risk topic... there are several posts on effective, natural blood thinners.... most recently, the one on Lumbrokinase... a fibrinolytic enzyme that isn't soy-based. Here's the link and at the end, there are other links to previous reports on natural thinners... and also important, the testing that can be done to document your risk ofby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
robh. - Your blood thinning regimen is of great concern to me. Although I relied on Nattokinase for many years since I was unable to stabilize warfarin for consistent INR.... and while definitely approve of the fibrinolytic enzymes, you may be over-thinning with your regimen. Be very sure you are aware of the consequences. Since I have a low platelet count, it's always been a challenby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Carey and all… I am not suggesting that afibbers forgo their prescribed medications and I totally understand your resistance, Carey, to natural therapies. This is not at all unusual or unique. I also agree that it’s important for every individual to determine what they want to learn and are willing to do for overall health in the long-term since we all have different influencing factors thatby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Following are two links that indicate Eliquis does function to break up clots. Moreover, an important consideration for everyone is to know the key inflammatory markers (by testing) that can underlie clot formation...as outlined in several posts on this topic. Links below. When inflammatory processes exist, then, in some individuals, that's a concern as is elevated fibrinogen.by Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Anti-Fib... Long ago, when I began my Afib journey, the rule was then, if you weren't on an anticoagulant... (and then there was only warfarin)... and the duration of your Afib event lasted 48 hours, you should have an ECV... and to plan ahead so that it was done before the 48 hours was up... thus, the "48-hour rule." That was because the ongoing duration in fibrillation was mby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
bolimasa - So kind of off topic, but... If inflammation is such a big deal, (and I'm not saying it isn't), how come they don't order any lab tests looking at it? It seems like everyone is always shouting inflammation, this food causes inflammation, gut flora and inflammation... Anecdotal I know, but I've not run into anyone who's worried about inflammation who'sby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Good question, Lance.... and an extensive topic since, as you note, there are several types of these enzymes that have varied properties and targets. Start with this previous post First, it’s important to recognize that the nomenclature for describing these systemic enzymes varies significantly depending on the source/bottler….and can be both confusing and misleading. There are othby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hello Anne - I can appreciate your apprehension about long-term use of Eliquis as I am ‘stuck’ on the half dose since the last ablation in 2015 and I agree that I’d rather be using the NK and Omega 3’s that worked for me so well for so long. Outside of eliminating afib, most important for avoiding future clot risk is recognizing contributing factors which typically involve the inflammatory pby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
For afibbers who are not yet required to use one of the prescription anticoagulants, we often recommend the fibrinolytic enzyme, Nattokinase ** which helps keep blood from hyperviscosity status. Because nattokinase is a soy-derived enzyme, people with soy sensitivities are not able to use it. There is another fibrinolytic enzyme that has been used for years and is even more potent thanby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hello Linda... and welcome. I can appreciate your questions and concerns about being a senior and taking anticoagulants and can also relate to your sensitivity to medications issue. I don't tolerate them well, either. Regardless of whether you consider an ablation procedure or not, the reality is that as we age, the risk of clot formation becomes higher with time, especially, if youby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Catherine - The recommendation for long-term use of aspirin should come with a caveat because of the potential risks that are documented by an abundance of studies over a long period of time. If the focus is to reduce inflammation - in this case, in those with Afib - then there are many other methods to do that more safely than take aspirin for a long time. It’s important to learn (from sby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM
Hi Ken... Just a few additional points in an extensive topic to emphasize why the risk of clots is always of concern at any age, but often, more so in the aging population and obviously, in those who have a history of arrhythmia. As we age, the heart muscle pumping capacity can diminish for a variety of reasons. It's all complicated by whether the heart is pumping overly thick bloodby Jackie - AFIBBERS FORUM