A different beat

When I go into AF now (at least I think it is) it is hard to determine if it is AF or some other arrthythmia, my heart beat is regular but fast. My regular rate is in the 60s, when I go into this different beat it goes into the 80s, so what I feel is a fast beat but not irregular. My two blood Pressure monitors do not show that I am having AF.. I see my EP in a couple of weeks and will ask him but I am posting this to see if anyone else has anything similar to what I am experiencing. When I used to go into AF I knew right away, it was a fast, irregular beat like something jumping around in my chest, it isn't that way now, I feel a hard fast beat but regular.

Liz

Atrial flutter with 4:1 conduction?

George:

I don't know much about A Flutter with 4:1 conduction, I didn't take my Propafenone as yet, do you think that will help or hinder. I see my EP this Wed., what do they do about this. This isn't new, I come out of it just like AF.

Liz

Could be A-Flutter Liz. Often it starts before AFIB but it’s not that uncommon for CTI Flutter to manifest after AFIB though it’s more common at a faster HR often well over 100bpm, but not always.

Shannon



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2018 01:31AM by Shannon.

Quote
Elizabeth
George:

I don't know much about A Flutter with 4:1 conduction, I didn't take my Propafenone as yet, do you think that will help or hinder. I see my EP this Wed., what do they do about this. This isn't new, I come out of it just like AF.

Liz

Good question, I'd call the EP and ask the question.

If it's completely regular, then it sounds like Flutter, or just simple Tachycardia. AFIB has Irregularity to it.
That's the rate I get when I have Flutter, in the high 80's.

I have a friend that has recently diagnosed with afib, finally caught it on an EKG. She had been to the Dr. numerous times not feeling well and even wore a monitor with no diagnosis. She doesn't notice the afib/excessive heart rate, but feels down, tired and out of breath. She is very over weight. I suspect that extra body weight conceals the heart arrhythmia, so that it's more difficult to "feel" the afib.

I am lean and when I was having afib before it was diagnosed and medicated, my heart rate jumped from 50's to up to 180 and extremely irregular. Once I knew what it was, there was no doubt when I went in or out of afib for the next 6 years before my ablation. I couldn't sleep on my left side when in afib, it just seemed like my body was jumping around on the mattress.

What I don't know is how varied the symptoms are for different people. Heart rate being one, but also the fatigue, breathlessness, etc.

Liz – sounds like flutter to me. I had dozens of flutter events so I recognized right away what it was.

When I began to have arrhythmia activity after 11 years of NSR after ablation #1, what I developed mostly was flutter. The rate is smooth and more ‘comfortable’ at 80 – 90 bpm than Afib although sometimes the flutter was 100 – 120 which was definitely more limiting. I had dozens of flutter events so I recognized right away what it was.

Since the initial flutter events weren’t all that frequent and were tolerable, I fiddled with it for quite a while but then, they became longer lasting… and when it didn’t self-convert after 24 hours, I would begin to make arrangements to get in for electrocardioversion to stay within the 48-hour rule since I wasn't on an anticoag. When those ECV trips escalated to sometimes twice a week, I made the date with Dr. Natale in Austin thanks to Shannon’s help.

Meds didn’t help.

Jackie

Anti-arrhythmic drugs (AARs) can promote flutter. It’s a tougher beast to medicate. Maybe a PIP approach with a beta blocker to tame the rate when in flutter? Then see an EP about ablation options. Right-sided (typical) flutter is a relatively easy fix, left-sided (atypical) not so much. Right/left would indicate what level of EP to proceed with. You want more experience on the left side of the heart, just as with AF.

Thank you to everyone that has responded to my post. It is strange but the months of Aug., Sept. and 1/2 of Oct. I didn't have any episodes of AF, now the last few months my episodes have increased to once a week, never had this amount of episodes. As I noted I used to know when I went into NSR, now I am not as sure. I do believe I am in NSR now the beat isn't as fast and is very regular.

I would go to Texas but I have a problem===as I have read a anti arrthythmic drug has to be taken before and for a while after an ablation, also, it is possible that a antiarrthythmic has to be taken for life. I can't take those kind of drugs I start to bleed inside, so what am I to do, I guess I will try to keep on going as I have done. I am better in the summer months, I will take more magnesium also.

I have a pacemaker and send in tapes to Ann Arbor for a check-they always say everything is ok, I will call tomorrow and see if they can tell if my episodes are flutter or just AF. I did cut back on my Propafenone this past week thinking it may be starting to be proarrthythemic, well I went into AF yesterday so don't think that is the problem.

The AF (or whatever) happens after I eat in the evening, it feels like I am full in my chest and then goes into the beat, I am going to try and take a probiotic and see if that will help, also get my thyroid levels checked again.

Liz

There certainly is a requirement to take an anticoagulant (blood thinner) in the months prior to and following an ablation, but I’m not aware of any requirement for an anti-arrhythmic. Perhaps that’s what you meant, but mis-typed?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2018 05:52PM by wolfpack.

I spoke to a pacemaker event nurse today. I am trying to find out if I have flutter or AF or what, the person said that I go in and out of rhythm, there can be long pauses between them, I know that when I sit down my rhythm is in NSR but when I move around it goes into AF rhythm. That is what the person said as well, he said that my Ventricular rate doesn't go that high in AF only to around 200 He doesn't seem to know what kind of rhythm it is, Af or flutter, but I don't think I have flutter. I know when I am completely out of AF, my heartrate feels different, I am in NSR now. Anyway I told the nurse to send a note to my doctor making him aware of my concerns as I am going to see him this Wed. This is all rather strange to me as years ago I knew right away when in AF and when out of it, it isn't quite that clear anymore.

Liz

Liz - I'm glad you have the appointment so you have clarity. From what you described last, it sounds like my events which were flutter.

One time early in my flutter trend, I was in flutter for about 30 hours and I was concerned about the 48-hour mark so I went to a nearby hospital ER hoping for cardioversion. Their treatment was chemical, which never worked for me, and didn't that time either, although the attending nurse and doctor congratulated me for the conversion. I could see on the monitor I was still in flutter. I was discharged and told meet with the supervising EP in the Cardiology wing which I did and he told me that I was fine but, eventually, I'd probably need another ablation. Perhaps he figured I couldn't tell I was in aflutter.

So, I went home, called the Cleveland Clinic for an appt. the next day for an EP consult. That ECG showed I was still in flutter. This was a Friday. The EP told me he thought I'd self-convert by Monday, but if not, to call and they'd do the Electrocardioversion. Fortunately, I did convert Monday but I was somewhat concerned about going well beyond the
48-hour limit when not taking an anticoagulant. Once again, all the natural blood thinners I was using protected me.

I hope you are able to get a definitive diagnosis. It's unsettling to not know. I can certainly relate.
Best to you,
Jackie